# Americhicken "new member"



## Americhicken (Feb 21, 2016)

Hello chicken farmers!

My name is Corey aka "AMERICHICKEN".
I am 29 years old, an american citizen serving in the US Navy stationed overseas in Chipiona, Spain for 3 years.

Chicken farming in Spain is very popular, so I have recently built a chicken coop and now have 10 chickens (2 roosters and 8 hens), and one duck. (possibly removing duck from coop for chicken health purposes soon). 

I have attached some photos for you to view.

I would love your help identifying breeds to the best of your ability. 

All advice is welcomed and all will be taken into consideration as I am NO expert.
My experience is limited to 2 years as I was being raised with my father but only 1 year first hand.

I have recently noticed that all of my chickens have those darn pesky LICE! YUCK! 
I also noticed that my Red Leghorn seems to have that foot disease called "bumble foot?" I think thats what you call it?  
Maybe you can take a look and tell me.  Sorry photo quality isn't the best. I can acquire more tomorrow if need be. Looking for advice here as he looks like he is in pain walking. He does not walk like the other hens or rooster. 

I only ask there will be no arguing on any of my posts. If you have a disagreement please keep it in message format and away from public attention out of respect for me and the other members.  

Thank you all and I look forward to engaging in many friendly posts!


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## nannypattyrn (Aug 23, 2015)

Hello and welcome! ! Thank you so very much for serving our great country! 
You came to the right place. We're a very friendly group even in disagreement. I've never seen any discord just at times "agree to disagree ".
The chicken with the bad foot does look like bumble foot and we have folks here who can tell you the right care. Also you can go on You Tube and see videos of how to care for her. Lice are wicked little creatures and can cause much damage. Are you talking about scaley leg mites or the body mites? Either way, I clean my coop down to the dirt floor and scub everything down before spraying with Sevin. I then check and powder my chickens with a mite powder as well as putting it in the areas they dust bathe.
There are several great experienced chicken people here who will pitch in when they get online agaon.


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## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

Wow, you must have been on some pretty nasty forums. Like Patsy said, we don't argue here. But there is always a but, isn't there? I can get frustrated when someone does something stupid that causes a bird more problems than if they had just asked first. There is nothing wrong about asking for help. It helps us all, it keeps our brains nimble, it reminds us of what we know or teaches us something new. With chickens there is always something new.

You're correct. Your boy has a bad case of bumble foot and will need to be addressed if you don't want him to get worse. As was mentioned there are quite a few youtube videos out there addressing the problem. In the interim you can soak is foot in warm epsom salts to soften that scab. Once it's softened remove the scab and try to excavate all of the pus in his foot. Even when you get the solids out there will be residual pus and that also needs to be irrigated out. Pack his foot with antibiotic and wrap it with vet wrap to keep the wound clean. He will need to go through soaking and repacking fairly regularly from there until it begins to clear up.

Bumble is a staph infection and move throughout his body if not addressed soon.

It's a challenge to offer advice on how to treat for mites and lice since you're in another country where they may not have what we do here in the states. Check you feed store, or whatever they call it, ask them what they have for poultry dust. 

BTW, nice coop. It's pretty obvious you gave it quite a bit of thought and looked to aesthetics as well.


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## Americhicken (Feb 21, 2016)

*Bumble foot Treatment Started.*



robin416 said:


> Wow, you must have been on some pretty nasty forums.


Ya you wouldn't believe some of the frustration I had when i went onto a FROG Forum. Unless your scientific your not a well respected member. It was a tough road and just ended up leaving the froggy world and now into the chicken world.

After I get this bumble foot situation worked out I will start with the Lice. Probably next week. My red leghorn easily has close to 500 lice on him after i looked closely when doing the bumble foot treatment and probably over 25K eggs. Is so scary. I am guessing that is why all his feathers do not come in complete or come in messy? Just a guess who knows. 

Here is some photos of the after treatment of bumble foot after a good clean soak and removal the the black and initial yellow. Did NOT notice any yellow PUSS. Just pure blood after removal of the black iciness.


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## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

So, I was sitting here eating eggs benedict when I opened your post. That was a mistake and I shut it down until my meal was over.

Looking at his foot, with nothing in my mouth, that still looks like solid pus that can be so easily seen and not the meat of his foot. Patsy can correct if I'm wrong but pus are white blood cells that attack the invader and eventually hardens and becomes a solid mass that unless removed will continue to cause problems for your guy. As gross as it sounds, try squeezing his foot to see if that yellow I see pops out. Oh man, I wish I hadn't eaten just before this. 

Luckily I've never had to deal with it first hand but I've seen some great suggestions for doing a complete irrigation of the area. One was using a water pic since it has some force behind it but not enough to do damage to delicate tissues. 

I think what all of us strive for here is a feeling of community. A strong, well balanced community is generally successful. I've found that since I grew up and became an adult, SS age here, I'm less apt to keep the brakes on and have to walk away and come back to a subject that really upsets me.


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## nannypattyrn (Aug 23, 2015)

Robin is right and the foot needs to be derided to the blood supply. I think the water pic idea is awesome! The foot may need to be soaked for a few more days to get the escarring completly off. It won't hurt to make it bleed some. Afer that you may try just some vaseline the wrap with Vet Tape ( coban is the same thing if you can find it.) You may need to go ahead a deal with the lice as well and maybe some nutritional supplements to boost the immune system. .


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## 8hensalaying (Jun 5, 2015)

Most of the time when I hear the word "pus" I think oozy. However since researching about chickens, I have learned that their pus is more solid and "chunky". Previous commenters are right, all that yellow needs to come out. Unpleasant but necessary  Welcome to the forum, this is a great group of people and I have never seen anyone get "out of line"


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## dawg53 (Aug 25, 2015)

Americhicken. You've gotten great advice regarding the bumblefoot problem. You havnt gotten all of the infection out yet. Bumblefoot is a staph infection; it is yellowish looking/cheesy like, can be solid. It is definitely NOT liquidy as in human pus. As mentioned, all of it must be removed at once. Once the infection gets past the legbone, it quickly spreads throughout the body, death ensues and there isnt any amount of antibiotics that will save the bird.
I recommend that you squeeze the heck out of the footpad to get the gunk out, then soak his foot in warm epsom salts water for 30 minutes to draw out the infection, then squeeze the heck out of the footpad again. Dont worry about blood. While squeezing the footpad, manipulate it in every way possible to get the gunk out, resoak again and squeeze again as necessary. It's possible you might have do some digging with tweezers to get it all out. 
Once it's all removed, flush with iodine or betadine and pack the hole with neosporin. Then put gauze over the hole. In lieu of vet wrap (if you cant find any,) you can use duct tape to wrap the wound and gauze. Dont put the duct tape on too tight. You'll have to use scissors to cut it off and inspect the wound a day later and dress it again until healed. Normally if the infection has been completely removed, complete healing takes about 5-7 days altogether.
I've done quite few bumblefoot surgeries. You have to be aggressive going after the infection. I've never lost a bird to bumblefoot.
Causes; like a splinter piercing the our finger and getting infected, same for a chicken. Rough surfaces such as rocks, heavy breed birds seem to be more susceptible. Lowering roosts and sanding down roosts eliminating burrs and splinters helps prevent bumblefoot, rake up and dispose of pine cones as well as pointed holly leaves that have fallen to the ground from holly bushes etc...
BTW: You should be able to get everything you need at the Navy exchange or commissary at Rota. I'm retired Navy, been to Rota quite a few times aboard ships.


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## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

It can happen with humans too if it has no path to escape. I've seen it when someone was chipping drugs in their heal. What a mess that was.


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## Americhicken (Feb 21, 2016)

You sir (dawg53) have given me the greatest push! Thanks for the extra info! I went in again tonight to exacto knife the infection completely out. Down to the pink and bloody. I put some neosporin in it but will tackle it again tomorrow for the LITTLE stuff. Thanks again!


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## seminole wind (Aug 22, 2015)

Welcome Corey!!! I'm glad you found us. I will have to study the pictures. For lice see if you can get Seven dust or poultry dust. Lice are easy to eliminate. 

There is no fighting here. We are all adults. You can post stuff and there will be no arguing. I would hate to know why you specifically said that. But anyway, welcome!!!

You did a real nice job with that Bumble. Good for you!

I love your coop. It is beautiful. How long have you wanted chickens?

I wish I could figure out what breeds they are but I can't. Maybe someone else can. I wonder if that white one with the big black spots is a Houdan mix? Just a guess.


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## dawg53 (Aug 25, 2015)

Now to address your lice problem. Poultry lice do not bite and suck blood like poultry mites. Lice are more of an irritant and birds will often scratch themselves causing scratched skin to bleed. Lice are opportunistic and will feed on the blood though. Lice normally feed on feathers, skin, and dander. They get their moisture from around the vent area and eyes. I've read that coconut oil will remove lice eggs, so there shouldnt be a need to trim or cut feathers. The commissary carries canned coconut oil. Sevin dust or permethrin dust will kill lice and mites. I recently had a small lice problem and used sevin dust and it was ineffective against the lice. I was shocked because sevin has always been effective against lice. I then purchased permethrin dust and it immediately killed the lice.
Here's how you thoroughly dust a chicken: I use a commissary paper bag and dump 1/4 canister permethrin powder in the paper bag. Then I put a chicken in the bag with its head sticking out the top of the bag. Gently close the bag around the chickens neck, snug but not tight. Then gently "shake and bake," then gently roll her around in the bag as not to harm her. Put abit of the dust on her neck and head and try to rub it onto her skin. Avoid the eyes and nostrils. She also might pass out but she will be okay once you let her out of the bag and she'll shake herself off and go about her business like nothing happened. Inspect all your chickens for lice/mites and dust them in the same manner. Make sure you wear chicken clothes, chicken shoes, and a mask when dusting. You WILL get dusted.
You will also have to dust the inside of your coop, nests, and roosts. A light to medium dusting will work on bedding. I usually "pat" it down after dusting. If you acquire new birds, quarantine them away from your existing flock for at least 6 weeks. This will give you time to thoroughly inspect your new birds for external parasites and treat for internal parasites. This will also give time for diseases to "show" themselves. Quarantining prevents exposure to your existing flock. Respiratory diseases have incubation times and course times. The majority of these diseases are extremely contageous and can be carried on clothing, hands, shoes etc. If you get the chance, you should read up on poultry biosecurity for more in depth details. It will save you time, money and heartache. Good luck.


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## Americhicken (Feb 21, 2016)

dawg53 said:


> Now to address your lice problem. I've read that coconut oil will remove lice eggs, so there shouldnt be a need to trim or cut feathers. The commissary carries canned coconut oil. Sevin dust or permethrin dust will kill lice and mites. I recently had a small lice problem and used sevin dust and it was ineffective against the lice. I was shocked because sevin has always been effective against lice. I then purchased permethrin dust and it immediately killed the lice.


Hey there. This is VERY ISIGHTFULL and I will immediately start the treatment this weekend hopefully. (I have a busy schedule or I would do it sooner)

QUESTION: Where can I purchase permethrin dust/power? Is this an over the counter item?

Also... I was thinking about doing a fee/tick dog bath ( I was told I could do this as an extra step to make sure I do eliminate ALL lice.) and bath each chicken in that first. Then go in with the coconut oil and comb as you recommended and after that rinse and blow dry. After that do the final dusting as you recommended. Is this ok? Or should I only do the dusting and coconut oil.

Lastly: Whats the difference between the lice and mites? The problems I have is thousands of eggs stuck on the feathers around the neck/ under the wings and on the feathery part of the legs. The little crawlies are yellowish to white to clear. NONE of them are on the scaly part of the legs. Strictly the body.


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## zamora (May 26, 2015)

Welcome to the coolest chicken forum! I love your coop and your chickens, you have a very pretty and functional setup.


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## nannypattyrn (Aug 23, 2015)

We can get the permethrin powder at Walmart, local plant nurseries. and feed stores. I'm guessing that the animal health stores may carry it. That's here in the states though, I don't know where you live how it's sold.
I'll defer your other questions to Dawg or one of the other more experienced chicken folks here.


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## chickenqueen (Jan 9, 2016)

Welcome,Americhicken!Thank you for your service to protect our great country!I think it's awesome you have chickens and I hope you enjoy them as much as the good people on this forum enjoy their chickens.Don't know much about bumble foot-thankfully-but do know about external parasites.Had a rat problem under my coop last year and with the rats came the lice.I moved the coop,got rid of the rats,then dealt with the bugs.In the past I used powders but the dust goes everywhere,the chickens got it in their faces and it got all over us and everybody breathed it in.Now I use a liquid spray-Permectrin II-you mix up and apply with spray bottle.You have so much more control where the product goes,just bury the tip in the feathers and go over the whole body paying extra attention to the butt area.It dries on feathers and skin,isn't shaken off and last for 30 days.Do the coop really good too, especially cracks and crevices.Use chicken approved products only-others could be toxic like flea shampoos.


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## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

CQ, you just reminded me about the flea shampoo that I wanted to comment on. Thanks for the reminder.

In the states flea shampoos contain pyrethrins for the most part or permectrin. Check the contents before using it since you are not stateside. You want to see those ingredients.


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## Americhicken (Feb 21, 2016)

Ok so I just looked at my dog shampoo for flees and ticks and you were right it has the permectrin medication in it!!! How exciting!

Ok after the first night of treatment I took some pictures of the bumble foot. Here it is. 

As you can see there is some yellow left but not TOO much. More digging to do!


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## Americhicken (Feb 21, 2016)

Ok so here it is after the SECOND Digging session and looks to be the final. Now its antiseptic and bandage time for what 7 days now?


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## dawg53 (Aug 25, 2015)

The footpad looks all cleaned out, good job! Flush with iodine or betadine, and pack the hole with regular neosporin ointment. Then place a gauze over the hole and wrap it up with vet wrap or duct tape. The key here is keeping the wound clean. Dont let your rooster walk in mudpuddles etc. 
You can remove everything in 48 hours and check the hole to see how it's healing. If there isnt any redness or pus buildup, go ahead and flush with iodine or betadine, repack the hole with neosporin and rewrap it. Check it again in another 48 hours and so on until completely healed.


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## dawg53 (Aug 25, 2015)

Permethrin dust and sevin dust are over the counter. They might be in the exchange garden center unless spanish law prohibits importation of these products. Otherwise I'd use the coconut oil on the lice eggs. The coconut oil is supposed to dissolve the lice eggs, you may not have to use a comb. If the powders arnt available, use the coconut oil first. Then use the dog shampoo, dry them using a hair dryer. I've used a hair dryer on my birds after cleaning poopy butt and they seem to like it. 
If dusts arnt available to treat the coop, nests, and roosts; remove ALL litter including nesting material and get rid of it. Then mix up a solution of bleachwater and spray roosts, nest boxes, walls, ceilings and flooring making sure all cracks and cranies are sprayed thoroughly. Bleachwater will kill lice. Let everything dry and then replace with fresh clean nesting material/bedding.


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## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

For a first go, that looks really good Corey. So often people don't do a total clean out of the wound and end up with a long term struggle trying to get it under control. 

Bet your boy begins to walk without a limp very quickly.


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## dawg53 (Aug 25, 2015)

Here's a link for you with closeup pics of poultry external parasites and description of each parasite. You would probably need a decent magnifying glass or microscope for exact identification. Be thankful that you're not dealing with poultry mites. I recommend that you familiarize yourself with each parasite for future reference, it's easy reading:
http://edis.ifas.ufl.edu/ig140


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## Americhicken (Feb 21, 2016)

dawg53 said:


> Here's a link for you with closeup pics of poultry external parasites and description of each parasite. You would probably need a decent magnifying glass or microscope for exact identification. Be thankful that you're not dealing with poultry mites. I recommend that you familiarize yourself with each parasite for future reference, it's easy reading:
> http://edis.ifas.ufl.edu/ig140


 Well its pretty Clear now I have the "shaft louse"


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## chickenqueen (Jan 9, 2016)

If you can get Permectrin II it can be used on the chickens and their living quarters.It leaves a residue on everything that continues to kill the parasites for up to 30 days.I treated mine who were infested and I treated them twice 2 wks apart.That was in October.Everybody is still bug free today, I check at least 1 daily,usually a couple more because I hold and love my chickens(unlike some people on the forum) and I don't want bugs either.Another thing you can do which I might do myself this year,is put the powder in the holes they dust bathe in that way they get it all over themselves.Good luck!


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## Americhicken (Feb 21, 2016)

You guys are awesome to provide such good intel for me and my new hobby. Today it looks like I have a "drunk" chicken. She stumbles a bit as if drunk and only picks up her right foot about 9/10 of the time ...the other 1/10 she drags it. I guess thats what I get for getting free chickens. Problems. But you know what!? Someones got to take care of them right? Might as well be me and my dedicated well being to keeping animals in good health. I will post progress of course on all the well beings of my chickens as I love sharing my hobbies with everyone =).


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## Americhicken (Feb 21, 2016)

Oh ya second problem.. My male mallard duck I am trying to let loose but he does not leave. He refuses to fly away despite having the ability. I don't want him to get my chickens water dirty and get my chickens sick.... Main purpose of me trying to let him loose. SO now he is out swimming in my pool amongst all places. He's such a hoot to watch!


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## chickenqueen (Jan 9, 2016)

I forgot to mention this;if you want to bathe your chickens use Dawn dish detergent.It is non-toxic to the chicken but will kill bugs now(excellent flea shampoo for dogs and cats and doesn't cause seizures like commercial flea shampoo).Chickens are hardy creatures but it doesn't take much to kill them.Whatever you decide to do make sure it's approved for use on chickens.


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## 8hensalaying (Jun 5, 2015)

also, you need to be careful if your duck is a drake, and you don't have a female. He may try to mate with your chickens and they are not anatomically compatible, it will hurt/damage your hens.


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## Americhicken (Feb 21, 2016)

8hensalaying said:


> also, you need to be careful if your duck is a drake, and you don't have a female. He may try to mate with your chickens and they are not anatomically compatible, it will hurt/damage your hens.


Another reason to let this handsome feller go to live and be free =)


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## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

I hesitate to jump on this possibility without a little more info but your drunk girl could be suffering from a toxin. Botulism is a big one in the states. She might have been bitten by something. 

Well, your Drake is bonded to your flock. You might end up having to take him somewhere there are other ducks for him to get the idea that they would be a better living situation.


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## Americhicken (Feb 21, 2016)

robin416 said:


> I hesitate to jump on this possibility without a little more info but your drunk girl could be suffering from a toxin. Botulism is a big one in the states. She might have been bitten by something.
> 
> Well, your Drake is bonded to your flock. You might end up having to take him somewhere there are other ducks for him to get the idea that they would be a better living situation.


 I will be keeping a close eye on her. She sits down with one leg sticking out when not walking. You could be right but only time will tell. Looks like my bumble foot guy is started to heal. Still walking somewhat out of whack but actually there is a noticeable difference compared to his "stair climbing" before the local surgery.

The drake will be let go with surrounding ducks. I will not let him go solo. Its not fair to him =(. I do like the little guy though. =)


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## jstringerrn75 (Oct 24, 2015)

I'm a nurse and the last pictures you posted look like nice, healthy tissue! Good job!

Welcome to the forum. I'm a newbie, like you and I love this forum. I have seen differing opinions, but I have never felt like I was being talked down to or that someone was mad. Everyone shares things they have done and tried and then you get a ton of information and the ability to choose what's best for you and your chickens. I think everyone here wants to help and genuinely loves chickens!

Your coop is fantastic! And you built it yourself! Awesome!

Thank you so much for your service! I can't say it enough. Protecting our country is such a huge, selfless gift to our citizens.


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## Americhicken (Feb 21, 2016)

jstringerrn75 said:


> Your coop is fantastic! And you built it yourself! Awesome!
> 
> Thank you so much for your service! I can't say it enough. Protecting our country is such a huge, selfless gift to our citizens.


 You comment truly just made my day. Thanks!


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## seminole wind (Aug 22, 2015)

Jess, I agree, Americhicken, thankyou for your service.

We as members make this forum what we like it to be. So far so good!


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## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

I heard something today that got my attention. I heard a couple of people talking about ducks. The lady who sounded like she knew what she was talking about said Rouns (sp) will not fly off but Mallards always do after they mature. makes me wonder if your drake is really a Mallard. Oh, she also said they look almost identical.


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## Americhicken (Feb 21, 2016)

robin416 said:


> I heard something today that got my attention. I heard a couple of people talking about ducks. The lady who sounded like she knew what she was talking about said Rouns (sp) will not fly off but Mallards always do after they mature. makes me wonder if your drake is really a Mallard. Oh, she also said they look almost identical.


No my drake is a Rouen. He does not have a white collar like a mallard. Which may explain why he refuses to fly.


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## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

Well, that explains why he hasn't left the flock then. Maybe find him a mate?


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## seminole wind (Aug 22, 2015)

I would find him a mate. I think he'll be happier with a female, and males are easier to rehome as a pair if need be.


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## Americhicken (Feb 21, 2016)

My coop is unfortunately too small for another duck or chicken. So I will have to let him go =(. In good news, I just became a 1 year supporter to this great organization / community.


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## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

That's great news that you like this place enough to stick around and share your experiences with us.


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## seminole wind (Aug 22, 2015)

Americhicken said:


> My coop is unfortunately too small for another duck or chicken. So I will have to let him go =(. In good news, I just became a 1 year supporter to this great organization / community.


That's great! 
Glad you like it here. We have a nice group going.


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