# Choking chicken



## WhitecatFarm (Oct 10, 2014)

Has anyone ever had a hen who repeatedly gets cracked corn stuck in her larynx? I have remove bits of cracked corn from this hen's larynx several times. She doesn't appreciate my efforts, but it keeps her from suffocating. She is the only one of my 30 odd hens that has this happen


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## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

Are you certain her airway is normal? There could be something there, like a growth, that prevents her from being able to swallow something too large.

Since this has happened repeatedly its best to remove it from their diet. It serves no real nutrition need, its just a treat.


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## WhitecatFarm (Oct 10, 2014)

Well, she is the only one having the problem, of course now her larynx is swollen, so makes it more likely to recur. This never happened to her last year. I hate to deprive the other 30 odd chicks and 19 guineas ...


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## WhitecatFarm (Oct 10, 2014)

Corn does provide calories


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## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

Empty calories. No true nutrition from it and this time of year the extra is not necessary in the heat. It's like us stuffing potato chips down our gullets.

You have to think about it differently. At this point it should be what is best for them? Is feeding a treat more important than doing them a disservice? You can switch to millet, its small, Guineas go absolutely bonkers over it. Chickens do too but not with quite the gusto that Guineas do.


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## WhitecatFarm (Oct 10, 2014)

My birds all free range and they get layer crumbles in the evening so a few "empty" calories won't hurt them. Since it is so early in the year the forage is not at peak yet, so I really want to be sure they get enough to keep their energy levels up. Heat is not an issue here in Downeast Maine. We still have some snow in places Can't get millet here.


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## WhitecatFarm (Oct 10, 2014)

I suspect she would choke on the millet... it is the smaller pieces of corn that get lodged


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## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

What you are failing to comprehend, its junk food. You said they only get feed one time a day, that means that hopefully enough nutrition is being found with foraging. Corn has very little nutrition so they are eating an unbalanced diet that serves no purpose. They do not need the extra weight adding calories in the Spring, Winter is over so they do not need the extra fat.

I would be very surprised if you can't find millet there. TSC carries it in their wild bird feed section. Walmart carries it in their wild bird feed section.


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## Fiere (Feb 26, 2014)

I agree, if you're worried about them getting enough to eat, feed more ration. Empty calories are great for keeping a bird warm in the winter but not for supplementation to their diet. 
And a few empty calories are hurting them if the bird is continuously choking on the corn. Why feed it if it's serving no purpose and making more work for you while hurting the bird?


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## WhitecatFarm (Oct 10, 2014)

Our tractor supply does NOT carry millet, neither does our Walmart... It was 41 degrees last night so feed that keeps them warm is still a good option for a while yet. I have been feeding corn or scratch feed to my birds for years with no problems, this is the first bird to do this.


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## WhitecatFarm (Oct 10, 2014)

*Layer pellets*
*Ingredients: 
*Wheat middlings, corn distillers dried grains with solubles, corn, soybean meal, L-Lysine, DL-Methionine, calcium carbonate, Sodium Bentonite, salt, ferrous carbonate, ferrous sulfate, copper sulfate, Manganous oxide, manganese sulfate, zinc oxide, zinc sulfate, Cobalt Carbonate, calcium iodate, sodium selenite, vitamin a supplement, vitamin d3 supplement, vitamin e supplement, menadione dimethylpyrimidinol bisulfite, thiamine mononitrate, riboflavin supplement, niacin supplement, choline chloride, calcium pantothenate, pyridoxine hydrochloride, folic acid, biotin, vitamin b12 supplement, propionic acid (a preservative


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## WhitecatFarm (Oct 10, 2014)

*Ingredients: 
Ingredients of chick starter*

Soybean meal, corn, wheat middlings, corn distillers dried grains with solubles, Monocalcium Phosphate, Dicalcium Phosphate, L-Lysine, DL-Methionine, calcium carbonate, Sodium Bentonite, salt, ferrous carbonate, ferrous sulfate, copper sulfate, Manganous oxide, manganese sulfate, zinc oxide, zinc sulfate, Cobalt Carbonate, calcium iodate, sodium selenite, vitamin a supplement, vitamin d3 supplement, vitamin e supplement, menadione dimethylpyrimidinol bisulfite, thiamine mononitrate, riboflavin supplement, niacin supplement, choline chloride, calcium pantothenate, pyridoxine hydrochloride, folic acid, biotin, vitamin b12 supplement, propionic acid (a preservative).


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## WhitecatFarm (Oct 10, 2014)

*Chick starter grower*
*Ingredients: 
*Wheat middlings, corn, soybean meal, corn distillers dried grains with solubles, Monocalcium Phosphate, Dicalcium Phosphate, L-Lysine, DL-Methionine, calcium carbonate, Sodium Bentonite, salt, ferrous carbonate, ferrous sulfate, copper sulfate, Manganous oxide, manganese sulfate, zinc oxide, zinc sulfate, Cobalt Carbonate, calcium iodate, sodium selenite, vitamin a supplement, vitamin d3 supplement, vitamin e supplement, menadione dimethylpyrimidinol bisulfite, thiamine mononitrate, riboflavin supplement, niacin supplement, choline chloride, calcium pantothenate, pyridoxine hydrochloride, folic acid, biotin, vitamin b12 supplement, propionic acid (a preservative


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## WhitecatFarm (Oct 10, 2014)

So empty calories ( corn) is one of the primary ingredients in chicken rations. Go figure


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## Fiere (Feb 26, 2014)

Monocalcium Phosphate, Dicalcium Phosphate, L-Lysine, DL-Methionine, calcium carbonate, Sodium Bentonite, salt, ferrous carbonate, ferrous sulfate, copper sulfate, Manganous oxide, manganese sulfate, zinc oxide, zinc sulfate, Cobalt Carbonate, calcium iodate, sodium selenite, vitamin a supplement, vitamin d3 supplement, vitamin e supplement, menadione dimethylpyrimidinol bisulfite, thiamine mononitrate, riboflavin supplement, niacin supplement, choline chloride, calcium pantothenate, pyridoxine hydrochloride, folic acid, biotin, vitamin b12 supplement, propionic acid (a preservative).

^^ and see all that? That makes the corn not an empty calorie. It is a FILLER in the feed used as a base because if they gave you a bag of all that listed above you'd have a bag of powder. They also put corn in dog food. The main ingredient in chicken feed is soy, which provides the protein, followed by corn, which is the filler, and then a whole bunch of vitamins and minerals to balance out the feed. 

Zebra finch and budgie seed is compromised of mainly millet. I can assure you, millet is widely available, although it may not be listed as "Millet". 

I know people don't like hearing that what they're doing may not be appropriate. I am not saying never feed corn. What I am saying is I don't know why you would continue to feed cracked corn when the corn is causing issue for the bird and it isn't really doing anything for the flock. Whole grains are fed in winter before roosting to keep the birds warm via digestion over night when the temps plummet and to provide extra calories to keep the birds in condition when their bodies are using extra calories to keep warm. If fed at any other time they're simply a treat. You can feed them all you want without issue for years and years and that is all when and good, but you are having issue with it NOW. Which is why you asked for help. 
Why keep feeding something that is causing issues, currently? Why not feed more of something else?


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## WhitecatFarm (Oct 10, 2014)

I did not "ask for help" I asked if anyone else had had the experience of a chicken choking on corn (or anything else for that matter).

I am having an issue with _one_ bird out of 60 or so, and I am feeding corn for just the reason you stated, to keep my birds warm and to provide a few extra ( albeit empty) calories to jump start them on these cold ( 40 degree F or lower) mornings. The amount I feed does not "unbalance" their diet. 
Soy is the main ingredient in chick starter, it comes _after_ corn in the other types of food.

BTW I do NOT feed my dogs food with corn in it... they are carnivores and are not designed to eat corn.


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## WhitecatFarm (Oct 10, 2014)

Corn is a verydesirable grain, for some reason a bunch of people (mostly on this site) believe that corn has no nutritional value which is very incorrect.​ 

TDN = Total Digestible Nutrients​ NEm = Net Energy of Maintenance​ NEg = Net Energy of Gain​ CP = Crude Protein​ NDF = Neutral Detergent Fiber​ ADF = AcidDetergent Fiber​ ​ *Table 1. Nutrient content of various feed grains (NRC, 1996).*​----------------------------------------------------------------- Corn Barley Wheat Oats Sorghum ----------------------------------------------------------------- TDN, % 90 88 88 77 82 NEm, Mcal/lb 1.02 0.94 0.99 0.84 0.91 NEg, Mcal/lb 0.70 0.64 0.68 0.55 0.61 CP, % 9.8 13.2 14.2 13.6 12.6 Escape Protein, % of CP 55 27 23 17 57 NDF, % 10.8 18.1 11.8 29.3 16.1 ADF, % 3.3 5.8 4.2 14.0 6.4 -----------------------------------------------------------------

*Table 2. Mineral content of major feed grains (NRC, 1996). * ---------------------------------------------------------- Corn Barley Wheat Oats Sorghum ---------------------------------------------------------- Calcium, % 0.03 0.05 0.05 0.01 0.04 Phosphorus, % 0.32 0.35 0.44 0.41 0.34 Potassium, % 0.44 0.57 0.40 0.51 0.44 Magnesium, % 0.12 0.12 0.13 0.16 0.17 Sodium, % 0.01 0.01 0.01 0.02 0.01 Sulfur, % 0.11 0.15 0.14 0.21 0.14 Copper, ppm 2.5 5.3 6.5 8.6 4.7 Iron, ppm 54.5 59.5 45.1 94.1 80.8 Manganese, ppm 7.9 18.3 36.6 40.3 15.4 Selenium, ppm 0.14 - 0.05 0.24 0.46 Zinc, ppm 24.2 13.0 38.1 40.8 0.99 Cobalt, ppm - 0.35 - 0.06 - Molybdenum, ppm 0.60 1.16 0.12 1.70 - ----------------------------------------------------------

*Table 3. Nutrient content of corn using different harvest, storage, or processing methods. * ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Escape Dry TDN, NEm, NEg, Protein, Corn Type Matter % Mcal/lb Mcal/lb CP, % % of CP ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Dry Rolled Corn 86 90 1.02 0.70 9.8 60 Ear Corn 87 83 0.92 0.62 9.0 60 Steam Flaked Corn 82 94 1.06 0.73 10.0 45 High Moisture Corn 75 90 1.02 0.70 10.0 40 High Moisture Ear Corn 75 83 0.92 0.62 8.7 40 High Moisture Snapped Corn 74 81 0.90 0.59 8.8 40 -------------------------------------------------------------------------


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## Fiere (Feb 26, 2014)

Sigh...

Whitecat, if I had a bird constantly choking on a foodstuff that I was only feeding to add empty calories, I would stop feeding it. Wouldn't matter if I fed it for 100 years without issue, I'd stop feeding it. 

If you want to feed something to give them additional calories and nutrition due to the lack of viable forage (as you stated before), feed more lay ration. If you want to feed them something that is a slow digestible to increase body heat (as you're now stating) there are dozens of other grains that will accomplish the same thing that the hen might not choke on. If you really are that attached to your cracked corn, separate the hen so she doesn't eat it or continue to put her through the stress of choking on it. 

As for the straw man argument with the feed: Why does it matter that ground corn is in the commercial ration or if it's the first or second ingredient? The higher the protein, the more soy will be in it - starter has the most protein and therefor soy will be first. Using commercial ration as an example of how chickens are supposed to eat corn is asinine. It is added to the feed as a filler the same way it is added to dog food. You're apparently very concerned your dogs do not eat unsuitable food, but are hell bent on feeding it to your chickens - they're not designed to eat grain either, you know. Grains however do have their place in a farmed chicken's diet. Provided they aren't causing issue. Which corn is for you for that one hen. So to reiterate, you can continue to feed corn and either make sure that hen doesn't get it/let her eat her fill and choke *or* find something else to feed that accomplishes the same thing. 

I have no idea why you are getting irate over this.


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## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

Remember the old saying? Does that hurt when you do that? Well, stop doing it. Essentially the same issue here.

You admitted that her throat is irritated by the corn, how will it heal if you keep giving it to her?


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## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

Whitecat, its obvious that you care since you asked the question. The surprising thing is that you're defending feeding them the corn even if it means your girl has continuing issues. As a former EMT/Resp Tech I can tell you that you are doing her a disservice. Which is confusing, you care but you refuse to accept that the corn is not the right thing to give right now. Sometimes the hardest thing to do is the right thing. The others will get over not having the corn. 

Everyone is assuming the issue with her throat was caused by the corn. That may not be what started it, she might have eaten or gotten something stuck you know nothing about setting her up for where she is now. 

Corn as a side treat is a cold weather treat, 40 degrees is no where near cold. Remember they have the best insulation going, feathers. Corn is for temps that are at freezing or below. Millet is a tiny round seed, the likelihood that it will get stuck is nil due to its lack of sharp edges.


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## WhitecatFarm (Oct 10, 2014)

I am not irate, I just feel as though you 2 were trying to bully me into feeding my flock the way you think it should be fed. Changing the (successful) diet of the whole flock to accommodate one challenged hen seems back wards to me. I separated the challenged bird and am feeding her soft food until her larynx heals, no one even suggested that until today. That was my first response when I realized the choking was not an isolated incident.
Robin, I am also a former EMT and was a lab technologist for many years before I retired as well as a veterinary tech. I know what millet is but as I stated before, I cannot get it here. So let's just drop this whole thing. I asked a question out of curiosity, wondering if anyone else had ever had a "choking hen" , not to look for a remedy, I had already determined that changing _her_ diet was sensible. Have a nice day.


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## Maryellen (Jan 21, 2015)

Amazon.com has millet along with everything else lol.. I buy millet and 25 lbs of dried mealworms from amazon for my hens. They dont get cracked corn . I do have / feeders filled with nutrena crumbles 24/7 for them even though they forage as well..


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## Maryellen (Jan 21, 2015)

I also feed in the winter warm oatmeal and the hens live it. If you are worried about the millet you can strip it from the branch as i do for my cockatiel .. This way she gets it but wont choke on a piece.. Or you can grind the corn to powder, maybe that will work too.


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## Nm156 (May 16, 2015)

I have one that is making choking sounds, don't know what i can do for it.


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## seminole wind (Aug 22, 2015)

I guess I might want to take a tube or something and stick it down it's throat to see if there's a blockage . If it's in the trachea, can't think of what I'd do.


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## dawg53 (Aug 25, 2015)

Any head/neck shaking? Neck stretching upward? Scratching neck? Gaping? Wheezing or gurgling?


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## Nm156 (May 16, 2015)

No , just that chocking type sound.I'll try to get a vid.She has something stuck in there.


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## dawg53 (Aug 25, 2015)

Try giving her about a teaspoon of olive oil and massage her from the upper neck to just down below her crop for about 5 minutes after giving her the olive oil.


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## seminole wind (Aug 22, 2015)

Hmm, little bit of a tiff above from last year. 

I used to think that corn had no nutritional value. It probably doesn't . However, since chickens supposedly lay an egg almost every day, they need corn as calories. I don't like middling anything. And too many grains give chickens problems aside from not being high calorie.


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## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

Believe it or not, corn does have some protein. Not sure it's enough to count for much though.


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## Nm156 (May 16, 2015)

Field/dent Corn 7-9% protein .....not to be confused with sweet corn
Oats 10-14%
Wheat 10-12%
Eggs 12%
Whole roasted soybeans 37%
Soybean meal 47%
Wheat Midds 14-15%
corn distiller grain 27%
Corn gluten meal 60%
Meat and Bone meal 55% ish
Fish meal 60%


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## Nm156 (May 16, 2015)

http://www.adm.com/en-US/products/Documents/ADM-Feed-Ingredients-Catalog.pdf


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## WhitecatFarm (Oct 10, 2014)

robin416 said:


> Believe it or not, corn does have some protein. Not sure it's enough to count for much though.


Amazing, I was pooh pooh'd when I pointed out that corn does have nutritional value.. Now it seems that you have switched horses


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## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

I am going to suggest you drop it at this point.


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## WhitecatFarm (Oct 10, 2014)

..........


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## seminole wind (Aug 22, 2015)

Nm156 said:


> Field/dent Corn 7-9% protein .....not to be confused with sweet corn
> Oats 10-14%
> Wheat 10-12%
> Eggs 12%
> ...


Should your percentages add up to 100%? It's been proven that some of these ingredients go slower thru the digestive system and make a chicken vulnerable to Enteritis / Clostridium.

I used to mix stuff into chicken feed like millet, fish meal, oats, but realized I was cutting into the calories of corn. I wonder if chickens would benefit from not having food ingredients like "middlins" or "meal". Would just the whole grain type be a benefit?


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## Nm156 (May 16, 2015)

Semi you have chickens that are 7-9 years old that have been eating "midds" and "meal" their whole life.What more proof do you need ?


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## seminole wind (Aug 22, 2015)

You're always around when someone needs a common sense check. Okay, I read too much.


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## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

I do the same thing and then stop to think for a moment and realize I'm worried for no good reason.


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## seminole wind (Aug 22, 2015)

I guess chickens have been living pretty well for a few hundred years on whatever we feed them. Although I do think that feed needs a meet supplement of something aside from chicken parts.


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## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

Except chickens did not live as long as they do now. I haven't looked lately but the last time I did they said the average life span for a chicken was five to six years. Hello!!! There are more than a few birds that have blown right past that number.


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## Nm156 (May 16, 2015)

One bushel of wheat yields approximately 42 pounds of white flour OR 60 pounds of whole-wheat flour.
http://www.quotewheat.com/cropfacts.php A Carbon Media site

So we see why we have an abundance of wheat midds.
The best parts were scraped off to make mostly junk bread.The kind that makes you "wonder" if it's really bread...


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