# Sand instead of hay or wood chips



## TonyQ (Apr 17, 2013)

Has anyone in the Northeast had any experience using sand in their coop instead of hay or wood shavings? It makes sense from a maintenance stand point but I'm curious about how it does during the winter. Any feedback or thoughts would be much appreciated.


----------



## chickenchick16 (Apr 19, 2013)

I would think that if water got mixed in the sand during winter and froze over....well you get the jist, but other then that I think it's a great idea


----------



## TonyQ (Apr 17, 2013)

I was thinking about that. Maybe sand in the warmer months but switch to hay or wood shavings once the frost settles in........


----------



## chickenchick16 (Apr 19, 2013)

Pine shavings would be best, because the hay could gather fungi and bacteria eventually causing sickness, but other then that I think it's a Great idea


----------



## GenFoe (Apr 3, 2013)

We are in Massachusetts and plan on using sand during the spring summer months then switch to deep litter method for fall and winter. 

I am using sand in the brooder and I can say the difference in how dirty my babes with feathered feet is incredible. The brahmas were caked in poop even after only a day with shavings. Now They are clean!


----------



## TonyQ (Apr 17, 2013)

Good to know. This should be an interesting project..........


----------



## Energyvet (Jul 25, 2012)

Sand is excellent. Nothing better. It is absorbent and will hold water but will not allow freezing. Easy to clean too. I use a little hay on tip of the sand then compost when done.


----------



## grandma5 (Apr 22, 2013)

I made my decision when I saw my lil comet walking around with a pine shaving stuck to her foot with poop! It looked like she was wearing a snowshoe!


----------



## jhddavis (Apr 7, 2013)

What do you do with it after the fact? I was planning on composting the shavings after cleaning the coop, but couldn't do that with sand. I have to say other wise, i am thinking if going with the sand.


----------



## Apyl (Jun 20, 2012)

jhddavis said:


> What do you do with it after the fact? I was planning on composting the shavings after cleaning the coop, but couldn't do that with sand. I have to say other wise, i am thinking if going with the sand.


You sift the sand and compost the poop .


----------



## jhddavis (Apr 7, 2013)

Can you keep using the sand or do you need to replace it?


----------



## Apyl (Jun 20, 2012)

jhddavis said:


> Can you keep using the sand or do you need to replace it?


 Keep using it, just sift out the poop.


----------



## jhddavis (Apr 7, 2013)

Thanks! I'm sold on the sand. One last question. Do you use the same kind used for a sandbox?


----------



## GenFoe (Apr 3, 2013)

Washed construction grade sand with no silica is what we are using


----------



## Energyvet (Jul 25, 2012)

$4 per bag at Lowes in NJ.


----------



## Apyl (Jun 20, 2012)

jhddavis said:


> Thanks! I'm sold on the sand. One last question. Do you use the same kind used for a sandbox?


I've purchased sand in 20 pound bags from a local lumber / home improvement place for $1.50 a bag. It was just non colored sand box sand.


----------



## Alyssa (Mar 28, 2013)

So like just pour it on the ground? Do you guys have edges to keep the sand in the run? Or is this just in the coop under their roosts?


----------



## jhddavis (Apr 7, 2013)

Should you only use sand if your floor is dirt or does it work with a linoleum floor too? If it doesn't absorb the liquid, does it just evaporate?


----------



## chickenaholic (Apr 11, 2013)

I live on the beach...could I just scoop some sand from outside for my brooder??


----------



## Chickens2022 (Aug 1, 2021)

Hi,

I'd like to reactivate this thread for a question regarding bedding. Probably like with most newbies in the planning phase, a big question for me is the bedding. Hay would be easiest to obtain, but I lean towards pine shavings because in my mind these are easier to maintain and probably less prone to mites infestations. However, when you think about what chickens like to do all day – they scratch away vegetation and love sand baths –, sand seems like a way to go, too. But to me, that would be practical only if you could keep the sand in the coop permanently or at least for a few years – as suggested in this thread. But wouldn't the sand get dusty and dirty over time even if you clean out the poop carefully? 
Does anyone have recent experiences with sand bedding?


----------



## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

Yes, to all of those things you thought might happen. 

I need to know something. Are you going to build a run off the side of the building where their digs are going to be? 

You really don't want hay because it molds and can cause respiratory issues. I put flakes of straw in my outside runs for them to dig around in. They had dirt in the runs for dust baths. Shavings are the easiest to use inside the coop for clean up and keeping the birds clean.


----------



## Poultry Judge (Jul 15, 2020)

Chickens2022 said:


> Hi,
> 
> I'd like to reactivate this thread for a question regarding bedding. Probably like with most newbies in the planning phase, a big question for me is the bedding. Hay would be easiest to obtain, but I lean towards pine shavings because in my mind these are easier to maintain and probably less prone to mites infestations. However, when you think about what chickens like to do all day – they scratch away vegetation and love sand baths –, sand seems like a way to go, too. But to me, that would be practical only if you could keep the sand in the coop permanently or at least for a few years – as suggested in this thread. But wouldn't the sand get dusty and dirty over time even if you clean out the poop carefully?
> Does anyone have recent experiences with sand bedding?


I use horse hay in the coops, (because that's what we have at the Sanctuary), especially during the winter months. The run has a duck pond and some areas with sand. I use old tractor rims to hold sand for dust bathing. Of course they dig their own holes too, so have a variety of soil to bathe in.


----------



## Chickens2022 (Aug 1, 2021)

robin416 said:


> I need to know something. Are you going to build a run off the side of the building where their digs are going to be?


Yes, absolutely! I wouldn't want to keep chickens without one. Actually, there will be two seperate spaces with seperate chicken doors in the coop. So I can change the area the chickens are in and always let one half regenerate. Unfortunately, I can't claim this good idea for myself, that's something the previous owner thought of. Each run is relatively spacious, but I can't tell you how big they are exactly. Probably around 500 to 550 square feet. I have to put up about 20 feet of new fence and sooner or later I'll have to redo all the fences, but for now they'll work.


----------



## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

Even if they were to free range it's always good to have a safe outdoor area in case predators become a problem.


----------



## Chickens2022 (Aug 1, 2021)

Well, our neighbours complain about martens and foxes, and goshawks are around too. But our neighbours also don't have any reasonably stable fence for thier chicken run, so I'm not surprised. The goshawks may become a problem, because we can't build a "roof net" or "ceiling net" 😅 (don't know how to call that in German either 😉) for the run. On the other hand, part of the reason why we can't do it is because there are trees and high shrubs, which should offer some protection against predators from above.


----------



## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

Or the predators will roost in the trees waiting. 

I don't know if you have this type of thing in germany but there is stuff called bird netting. It's aggravating as all get out to work with but it would allow you to put it up around or on top of all the foliage because it's very light weight and flexible. I'll see if I can find a link so you can see what I mean.

I know @Poultry Judge uses it quite extensively.


----------



## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

Here, this one is pretty good. https://www.amazon.com/Netting-Heavy-Protect-Plants-Fruit/dp/B00XIRH1CC


----------



## Poultry Judge (Jul 15, 2020)

robin416 said:


> Or the predators will roost in the trees waiting.
> 
> I don't know if you have this type of thing in germany but there is stuff called bird netting. It's aggravating as all get out to work with but it would allow you to put it up around or on top of all the foliage because it's very light weight and flexible. I'll see if I can find a link so you can see what I mean.
> 
> I know @Poultry Judge uses it quite extensively.


Yes, and I hate the stuff. It takes a while to get it right, especially if you have birds going in and out like I do with the peafowl and turkeys. The Cleveland Zoo has an actual aviary, I wish I had a setup like that.


----------



## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

So do I but I haven't tried to use it like you have. Which would probably mean I'd hate it even more. 

I'll bet with some good pics we can come up with fixes once C2022 gets everything ready to use.


----------



## Poultry Judge (Jul 15, 2020)

robin416 said:


> So do I but I haven't tried to use it like you have. Which would probably mean I'd hate it even more.
> 
> I'll bet with some good pics we can come up with fixes once C2022 gets everything ready to use.


Certainly looks like a good start.


----------



## Chickens2022 (Aug 1, 2021)

robin416 said:


> So do I but I haven't tried to use it like you have. Which would probably mean I'd hate it even more.
> 
> I'll bet with some good pics we can come up with fixes once C2022 gets everything ready to use.


Well, there is something like a clearing in the first half of the run (next to the coop). It would probably be a good idea to install some bird netting there. So I guess you're right and I am going to come back to this topic once it's urgent.
However, there's not much I can do about the trees and shrubs. There's an apple and an elder tree from which we harvest, and in the back area of the run the shrubs are quite high so that they form a roof – it's really cozy under there 😅 Also, my wife would probably protest if I try to cut the shrubs down...


----------



## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

Well we know PJ hates it but he will be a good source to tell you how to work with the netting and leave your existing vegetation alone. Something to think of too, unless your run fence is really tall the first year your birds will go adventuring over the fence. It's what they do. And no talking to them can divert them from doing it.


----------



## Poultry Judge (Jul 15, 2020)

robin416 said:


> Well we know PJ hates it but he will be a good source to tell you how to work with the netting and leave your existing vegetation alone. Something to think of too, unless your run fence is really tall the first year your birds will go adventuring over the fence. It's what they do. And no talking to them can divert them from doing it.


Ha ha ha, my minimum fence height is six feet everywhere and the only birds that cannot fly out for sure are Goliath and the Gonzo the tom turkey.


----------



## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

Speaking of Goliath, how is he doing?


----------



## Poultry Judge (Jul 15, 2020)

robin416 said:


> Speaking of Goliath, how is he doing?


He is doing okay, almost never leaves the coop anymore.


----------



## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

Darn it, I hate that. You know what I'm going ask don't you? Do you have AC in the house? If you do it can make things easier for him.


----------



## Poultry Judge (Jul 15, 2020)

robin416 said:


> Darn it, I hate that. You know what I'm going ask don't you? Do you have AC in the house? If you do it can make things easier for him.


No AC, I do have a triage/quarantine room right off the mud room. My concerns with Goliath involve him becoming lame at some point in the future. I really don't know the extended lifespan of a broiler.


----------



## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

From everything I've ever read from others that decided to keep a couple around it all had to do with restricting their food intake. How long they lived beyond a year, I don't know. 

I just hate it for him though. Reason I was thinking of AC is that they can also have heart issues. It seems like if they can stay in a more climate controlled environment the better they do. I did that with a Hamburg rooster with heart issues. He lived for another year after I discovered him down. Got him out of the heat and into AC, he recovered quickly. Of course that was only a stop gap and the heart issue won in the end.


----------



## Poultry Judge (Jul 15, 2020)

robin416 said:


> From everything I've ever read from others that decided to keep a couple around it all had to do with restricting their food intake. How long they lived beyond a year, I don't know.
> 
> I just hate it for him though. Reason I was thinking of AC is that they can also have heart issues. It seems like if they can stay in a more climate controlled environment the better they do. I did that with a Hamburg rooster with heart issues. He lived for another year after I discovered him down. Got him out of the heat and into AC, he recovered quickly. Of course that was only a stop gap and the heart issue won in the end.


Other than separating him, I don't have a mechanism to restrict his food intake.


----------



## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

Separating would probably just as bad as his excessive food intake. The other that talked about keeping them around had the space and had more than one they were trying to keep.


----------



## Poultry Judge (Jul 15, 2020)

robin416 said:


> Separating would probably just as bad as his excessive food intake. The other that talked about keeping them around had the space and had more than one they were trying to keep.


Yes, I can' take him away from his compadres. He is social with everyone as they enter and exit the coop.


----------



## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

I WANT TO FIX HIM! dang it.


----------



## Poultry Judge (Jul 15, 2020)

robin416 said:


> I WANT TO FIX HIM! dang it.


Yes, and if you think about it, he is literally the product of commercial farm breeding and engineering to make chickens, turkeys, pigs, and steers which can't even live a decent life as an individual animal. It's horrifying really. Even a hundred years ago we didn't have these giant meat birds on a commercial scale, or broad breasted turkeys that cannot reproduce. People did breed giant chickens for the state fairs, like my avatar, humans have to mess with everything.


----------



## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

I know. I was just as guilty breeding my Silkies although I had stop point. None of that head touching the tail stuff.


----------

