# New closeups of Bumps.



## seminole wind

I don't think he's feeling too well either.


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## Nm156

Tumors ?? Just a guess.


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## seminole wind

I think tumors is a good guess. Maybe I should take him to the vet?


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## Alaskan

They almost look like warts... Totally odd.

Probably worth a vet visit. IF you think that your vet is knowledgeable enough to handle it.


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## robin416

If the vet doesn't immediately identify them as tumors a scraping can be done to look at under the scope.

And whatever that is, it's far more than my friends that turned out to be mites. What I remember they told her that either the mites were forming a waxy substance to protect them or something like that.


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## casportpony

The avian pathologist I sent the first set of pictures to said something like "looks like it could be warts, which is extremely rare in chickens". How is he feeling?


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## seminole wind

He is not feeling too well. he's eating and drinking, but no pep. I also think he's breathing odd. Like taking really large closed mouth breaths-not quick. So I wonder if these are internal at all. 

Robin, I looked for mites. I know what you mean, I've seen it in birds where the mites create these structures. But these are much more like warts or some strange tumor growths. I was looking at something that causes one button like tumor on a dog and it looks similar but only grows one at a time.


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## robin416

I would like cas to explain further that thing about the warts, like the mites that make the waxy substance I've never heard of them on chickens.

Sem, one of my dogs has that growth. It's been there for years and since he's ten years old, a big dog, I've chosen not to have it removed. It doesn't seem to be doing anything so maybe I made the right choice?


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## casportpony

There is an avian pathologist at UC Davis that does my necropsies and he is always interested in seeing pictures of unusual conditions.


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## seminole wind

robin416 said:


> I would like cas to explain further that thing about the warts, like the mites that make the waxy substance I've never heard of them on chickens.
> 
> Sem, one of my dogs has that growth. It's been there for years and since he's ten years old, a big dog, I've chosen not to have it removed. It doesn't seem to be doing anything so maybe I made the right choice?


That's what I was seeing online last night. Something on dogs that is possibly caused by a virus and goes away on it's own. Some are shrinking but others are popping up.

Maybe he's old and succumbing to odd stuff.


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## seminole wind

Okay, He's got an appointment with my vet on Monday. At least he can take his best guess .


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## robin416

Fuzzie's got bigger and then stopped growing. Been there for who knows how long since I've forgotten. The initial scare was of Melanoma since my Keepher did have one but it wasn't right for that visually so I left it be.


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## seminole wind

These keep multiplying. I worry that they're inside too.


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## robin416

seminolewind said:


> These keep multiplying. I worry that they're inside too.


Sorry, I was referring to my dog with that flat growth thing going on.

Glad you've got the option for a vet visit. So many don't.


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## seminole wind

robin416 said:


> Sorry, I was referring to my dog with that flat growth thing going on.
> 
> Glad you've got the option for a vet visit. So many don't.


I knew you were talking about your dog! Really!
My vet , I think he has knowledge but is willing to learn as well. He's euthanized a few chickens for me and set a broken leg. He's very nice.


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## pinkmartin

Definitely an interesting thing to see. Keep us posted on how things go.


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## seminole wind

I will. Dontcha love it when people update stories or happenings?


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## pinkmartin

More to the point, I hate when someone comes begging for info about what to do or what could it be and everyone who reads it becomes invested in what happens to some critter and then they never come back. It's like these people just get sucked into a black hole.


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## seminole wind

Oh yea, Pink. Just leaving people hanging. 

My special love is when someone has a problem and they go for hundreds of posts and never solve the problem no matter how many suggestions, it's never the right one. I usually think of them as posting for attention-the equivalent of a troll.


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## casportpony

I wonder if the pathologist at UC Davis would be interested in getting a sample of the growths?


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## pinkmartin

Yep yep yep!


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## robin416

seminolewind said:


> Oh yea, Pink. Just leaving people hanging.
> 
> My special love is when someone has a problem and they go for hundreds of posts and never solve the problem no matter how many suggestions, it's never the right one. I usually think of them as posting for attention-the equivalent of a troll.


Notice they never answer one question? After I see that I just think, "You're on your own there pal."


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## robin416

casportpony said:


> I wonder if the pathologist at UC Davis would be interested in getting a sample of the growths?


I was wondering the same thing. Might be a good idea to put them in touch with each other. This might be a good learning thing for everybody.

Although, I've never even seen anything like that, ever. Leave it to Sem to have the rarest of the rare happening.


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## seminole wind

I had a hen necropsied that died from a rare chicken liver or pancreatic cancer. It took them a while to figure out what it was.

Yea if my vet is interested, I could mail a chunk to somewhere. Anyone have a name and address or email?


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## casportpony

seminolewind said:


> I had a hen necropsied that died from a rare chicken liver or pancreatic cancer. It took them a while to figure out what it was.
> 
> Yea if my vet is interested, I could mail a chunk to somewhere. Anyone have a name and address or email?


I will PM or email you his contact info. If you do contact him, let him kow this is the rooster that I sent pics of on 8-3. Email title was "Bumps on Comb"

He also mentioned that he'd would be interestied in studying this and asked if you would be willing to donate him. I didn't ask you, 'cause I figured he was a pet and didn't want to sound insensitive.


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## casportpony

PM sent. If anyone would like the name of a great avian pathologist, just send me a PM.


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## seminole wind

Thanks I got the pm. I can mail him a sample or even send the body WHEN the pet expires. I'm glad when there's someone out there who never closes the door to learning or investigating something new.


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## Alaskan

Yep, learning is fun, and needs to be life long.


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## casportpony

seminolewind said:


> Thanks I got the pm. I can mail him a sample or even send the body WHEN the pet expires. I'm glad when there's someone out there who never closes the door to learning or investigating something new.


He's an interesting fellow and is always willing to take my calls and reply to my email, which is nice. He's not one to offer advice, 'cause legally he can't, but does encourage me to send interesting pictures his way, and has made suggestions on how to improve my necropsy pictures.


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## pinkmartin

Just think. Could be something new.


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## casportpony

This Dr. is also interesting in avian eyes, so if any of you ever run across something with strange eyes, please send me the pictures so I can forward them to him.


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## seminole wind

I hope it's not something new. I realize this is one of my oldest silkies who was the father of offspring with Typhoid Mary who was also a silkie. So the little dude has probably lived his life with some sort of immunosuppression from Marek's.


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## pinkmartin

That makes sense. I did A lot of reading about chickens before we got them. I saw a lot of weird injury/disease pics. Nothing like that, though. I wonder if it could be something more common but has progressed differently due to suppressed immunity? 

Am I the only one who finds it strange that you don't see wild birds with weird abnormalities or nests full of eggs that didn't hatch? Why do these things happen in domesticated birds but not so much in the wild? Are domestic birds manipulated so much genetically that it weakens them and causes these problems?


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## seminole wind

http://www.michigan.gov/dnr/0,4570,7-153-10370_12150_12220-26362--,00.html

Looks like it may be a severe form of pox.

http://www.open.edu/openlearn/natur...n-pox-and-how-can-i-help-the-fight-against-it

http://wildlifedisease.unbc.ca/avian_pox.htm

http://www.backyardchickens.com/t/941752/rooster-has-bumps-on-face/0_50


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## pinkmartin

So apparently it is present in wild birds, I just have never seen it. 

Sounds like in some cases the bird recovers from this, but that it's highly likely to spread through a flock. Any chance of getting the immunisation? If all of your birds have Mareks, they would all be susceptible?


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## robin416

I just thought I saw pox in all it's forms. Your guy blows this out of the water. I wonder if your vet will have a better idea than using things to dry it up.


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## casportpony

I had pox here in 2013 and the bumps on his face don't look like any of mine did. If it were pox, I would expect to see more than just one with it. You also said that you can't remove his bumps, but with all of mine you could.


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## seminole wind

I'll have to ask the vet what my options are. I also hope he can scope strudel's throat to see about his airway. Poor little guy is 7.5 years old and I wonder how much he can handle. And whether cutting some off would hurt. Because there are some that look like they interfere with his nose and eyelids. 

I've had a few get pox but just the regular black ones. One of my Polish roos got them and they were plenty black spots but his was sick with it. Then he kept getting bumble foot and limping and I put him down because it wasn't worth the pain he had to go thru to keep removing bumbles.

Yea, strudel has big awful ones. After looking at those pictures, there are bad cases. Never knew that.


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## Alaskan

pinkmartin said:


> Am I the only one who finds it strange that you don't see wild birds with weird abnormalities or nests full of eggs that didn't hatch? Why do these things happen in domesticated birds but not so much in the wild? Are domestic birds manipulated so much genetically that it weakens them and causes these problems?


I think it is out there... You just don't usually see it, since often sick birds go and hide, or are quickly eaten by predators.

I clean out nest boxes every year (chickadees and swallows) and sometimes there are unhatched eggs, and dead chicks. One year a chickadee nest box had one failed nest (one unhatched egg and I think two dead chicks) and then they put a second nest on top of the failed one and were successful (luckily it is cool enough here that the dead chicks just desiccated, no nasty rotting).

Just last week the Alaska bird list I am on posted a photo of a chickadee with cross beak. Just this summer I had one Stellar Jay fledgling with one messed up eye.


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## pinkmartin

See. I wondered about that. I have finch houses all over my yard. I never clean them out. Maybe I should.


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## seminole wind

pinkmartin said:


> So apparently it is present in wild birds, I just have never seen it.
> 
> Sounds like in some cases the bird recovers from this, but that it's highly likely to spread through a flock. Any chance of getting the immunisation? If all of your birds have Mareks, they would all be susceptible?


I was reading and searching for weeks on tumors, papillomas, and stuff. But for the heck of it I used the word avian pox and got all these pictures. I think the common is those black spots that run thru a few chickens. One of my roos got the black spot pox and had it bad and looked so sick. His immune system was shot.

It looks like there are different forms or strains of pox virus. Many don't grow out like his, but according to those pictures, he fits right in!

I think that my birds are susceptible to strange things or like getting something bigger than another chicken would. I think it's too late to vaccinate , it seems it's got to be done day one of life. And I read to never give the vaccination to a bird who's got active pox. And once a chicken gets pox, they are immune.

I don't think strudel cares if he's immune next time. I don't think the doc is going to do much. I'm not sure how painful it would be to remove a few. Or if I can. I'd also like the vet to scope his throat. He has 3 hens living with him that are fine. So I'm thinking that the hens are younger and more resistant. I guess I should separate them but it's been a few months already. He's such a sweet little thing.


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## pinkmartin

It's never easy to see someone in your care sick. To me it makes no difference if it's a kid or an animal. I'm so thankful that so far our birds are healthy. I do need to worm them soon, I guess. I need to look into the wormers that don't require tossing eggs. The only thing I have on hand is ivermectin horse paste. I used it when we brought in a new pet rat as a rescue and he had lice. I used it for a cat with eat mites, I think also.


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## seminole wind

I think that Valbazen has no withdrawal period. But Dawg53 is up to date on that stuff.


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## robin416

Ivermectin doesn't, I haven't heard that Valbazen doesn't.

A few months back I found that a study was finally done on whether whatever we give the hens ends up in the eggs, it does. At very low amounts. They used one of the wormers we use but I don't remember which one it was. But most of the wormers we use with the birds are also used in humans.


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## pinkmartin

So robin, you think I can use what I have and not toss eggs? Do you happen to know the dose?


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## casportpony

There are some studies that say ivermectin is not an effective poultry wormer, but if you want to use it, the dose is 0.2 mg to 0.4 mg per kg, though some people give 6x to 12x the recommended dose.

Using 1.87% paste, the 0.4 mg dose for a six pound chicken is this:
6 / 2.2 x .4 / 18.7 = 0.05 ml


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## pinkmartin

Hmmmm. Hate to give them something that may not help them. I wonder if it does or not. I'll do some searching. Only other thing I have is dog wormer.


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## robin416

casportpony said:


> There are some studies that say ivermectin is not an effective poultry wormer, but if you want to use it, the dose is 0.2 mg to 0.4 mg per kg, though some people give 6x to 12x the recommended dose.
> 
> Using 1.87% paste, the 0.4 mg dose for a six pound chicken is this:
> 6 / 2.2 x .4 / 18.7 = 0.05 ml


My vet from our old place said the same thing about Ivermectin, that it was not formulated for the GI tract of dogs. Made me think the same would be true of chickens.


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## robin416

What wormer do you have for the dogs? Albendazole? That can also be used in chickens but you would have to know how much to give since the mg strength could be higher or lower than using the goat wormer.


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## pinkmartin

I just read multiple articles about using ivermectin in poultry. I'm more confused. Some consider it the holy grail of parasite protection. Others, like you may as well roll your birds around in a bin fill of worms and mites. All said you must withhold eggs and meat for anywhere between 5 days and 2 weeks. Although, I would think the dose you would get from eggs would be miniscule and ivermectin is actually used in humans, presumably in higher doses than in chickens.


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## pinkmartin

I can't find the dog stuff. I believe this is what I have...

D-Worm liquid treats large roundworm (Toxocara canis,Toxocara cati,*Toxascaris leonina) infections in kittens, cats, puppies and dogs


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## casportpony

pinkmartin said:


> I can't find the dog stuff. I believe this is what I have...
> 
> D-Worm liquid treats large roundworm (Toxocara canis,Toxocara cati,*Toxascaris leonina) infections in kittens, cats, puppies and dogs


I think that's pyrantel pamoate. Not sure what poultry worms other than large roundworms it will treat. Also don't know what the dose is, but will look it up.


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## robin416

What exactly are you trying to do? Do you have signs of worms? Wormers are specific to the types of internal parasites. Like Wazine is for round worms only.


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## casportpony

robin416 said:


> What wormer do you have for the dogs? Albendazole? That can also be used in chickens but you would have to know how much to give since the mg strength could be higher or lower than using the goat wormer.


Bang for the buck, Valbazen is the way to go, but I would not use it in mammals unless my vet gave the okay. The book I have mentions something about aplastic anemia in mammals, which is why I would consult a vet first.

Being the anal person I am, I always research doses and dose everything by weight. Valbazen (11.36% albendazole) dose is ~0.08 ml per pound (20mg/kg) orally and repeat in 10 days. Do I weigh every bird? No, I just guess and give a dose.


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## pinkmartin

I have seen no signs, but my understanding, I guess, is Its better to catch it before it does enough damage that you know it's there? Being tight on money, was just wondering if anything I already have would work. If not, it will go on my list of when I get a few extra bucks, these are things we need.


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## seminole wind

Update. Poor Strudel gasped all the way there and hid his head in my arm. 
The vet said he thinks it's pox and because of his age or immune status, it became this. He said there's nothing he can do. 
He said I should put Neosporin on any that open up to keep the infection out. Give him vitamins and some good foods like yogurt. make sure he's wormed and free from parasites. He scoped his throat and it was clear. 

During this exam he laid there like the living dead with his eyes closed, gasping. I didn't think he'd make it home. But he did. And when we saw the chickens he perked right up. I put him down and he did the "dance" around me, then danced around a hen and was talking away. The vet said it's good he's keeping his weight. I think so too. 

So I'll do every thing I can and he can live as long as he wants to.
Anyone have any suggestions on some healthy possibly high protein stuff I can give him?


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## robin416

Well, I guess that's some good news.

See that girl in my avatar? She did the same thing. She might have done better if I put her in a dark carrier but the moment I put her in my truck I thought she was going to die on the spot.


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## seminole wind

She's a cute hen! What happened with her?


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## seminole wind

pinkmartin said:


> I have seen no signs, but my understanding, I guess, is Its better to catch it before it does enough damage that you know it's there? Being tight on money, was just wondering if anything I already have would work. If not, it will go on my list of when I get a few extra bucks, these are things we need.


The cheapest way I would know to go is with safeguard horse paste, Kathy or Dawg53 can give you the dose and how many days. The tube of safeguard is pretty cheap.


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## casportpony

seminolewind said:


> The cheapest way I would know to go is with safeguard horse paste, Kathy or Dawg53 can give you the dose and how many days. The tube of safeguard is pretty cheap.


One tube of paste is cheap, but it will not treat that many birds. better to save up $25 and get the bottle of liquid.


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## seminole wind

casportpony said:


> One tube of paste is cheap, but it will not treat that many birds. better to save up $25 and get the bottle of liquid.


Good to know!


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## casportpony

What I should have asked was how many hens do you have and what breeds are they?


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## Alaskan

Healthy stuff... I would think the best would be scrambled eggs.


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## robin416

seminolewind said:


> She's a cute hen! What happened with her?


She died some years ago.


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## casportpony

robin416 said:


> She died some years ago.


So sorry. She was very pretty.


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## seminole wind

Alaskan, yes, I was thinking that eggs would be good. I had gotten a hen back to eating by soaking bread in raw egg, and sprinkling sugar in it. She gobbled it up.

I think the vet reminded me how important supportive care is. I really never considered he may need it. But he was dusted tonight, and will be wormed, get some good special food, and vitamins in the water.

Robin, your cute hen reminds me of how bad it hurt when I lost my first silkie roo, Mushmouse. I cried for a week.


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## Alaskan

I would worry a bit about worming an animal that is already having issues... Worming can be hard on a critter.


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## seminole wind

Alaskan said:


> I would worry a bit about worming an animal that is already having issues... Worming can be hard on a critter.


Okay, I'll hold off . He is a good weight.


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## pinkmartin

Right now we have 13 total. 2 of those are bantam. 1 is a silky mix


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## robin416

Sem, I remember Mushmouse or at least I remember the name. 

I'm waiting to see how it goes when King decides it's time or Head Tuck. Ten years and nine years old respectively. Might be a tough day.


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## seminole wind

robin416 said:


> Sem, I remember Mushmouse or at least I remember the name.
> 
> I'm waiting to see how it goes when King decides it's time or Head Tuck. Ten years and nine years old respectively. Might be a tough day.


That is so old!!! Are they silkies?


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## robin416

Yep, both are. King has been a target of mites the last couple of years so I have to watch him closely. Head Tuck struggled with the heat and humidity this year. I just lost Bobble last month, he was nine. Then it's the two sister hamburgs that are seven, Chicklett and her two brothers that are six. 

No way were those old birds going with the rest of the flock when I sold out. Chicklett wasn't old but she's such a witch and I enjoy her personality so I kept her.


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## seminole wind

I know. My retirees stay. 
I have a silkie roo friend now. He stays by my side. He doesn't mind me picking him up. But then again, nobody minds being picked up.

Hey remember the name Ugly Eddie? He's the one that had the brain swelling.


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## robin416

No, I don't remember that name. I think I remembered mushmouse because it was one of those names that elicits a grin.


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## seminole wind

Awww. yea Mushmouse was one of those roos who attacked me, had some behavior modification, and became my little friend. Behavior modification had to do with stalking him for about 10 minutes a day, making him keep moving . And in about a week, he was nice.


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## seminole wind

Tonight is the first night that Strudel didn't walk up the plank to the coop. He stood in one spot all day. I wonder what would happen if I cut those things off, or just leave him alone.


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## Alaskan

seminolewind said:


> Tonight is the first night that Strudel didn't walk up the plank to the coop. He stood in one spot all day. I wonder what would happen if I cut those things off, or just leave him alone.


Cut what things off?

What did I miss?


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## seminole wind

See post #1. Vet said they are dry pox gone crazy.


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## Alaskan

Now I remember! Silly me.

How is he doing today?


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## seminole wind

I don't know Al, he is really depressed looking. Those bumps are dry . I wonder if I should pull one off? I wonder if I should put him on antibiotics? I wonder if he has eye infections because they look so bad. I just need to do something.


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## dawg53

seminolewind said:


> I don't know Al, he is really depressed looking. Those bumps are dry . I wonder if I should pull one off? I wonder if I should put him on antibiotics? I wonder if he has eye infections because they look so bad. I just need to do something.


If in fact it's fowl pox, dont remove the nodules. They will eventually go away on their own. Removing them will cause bleeding and if the blood gets into the eyes, nostrils, mouth; there's risk of wet pox as well as spreading it to other birds via birds picking at the blood. You dont want to deal with wet pox.
You can put shoe polish on the nodules to help dry them up. Dont put too much, it'll melt. Iodine will help dry them up, avoid the eyes and nostrils. Antibiotics would be only used for a secondary infection, fowl pox is a virus.


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## seminole wind

Thanks, Dawg. I know it's a virus but those things have been there for a long time. Like a few months. Oh well.


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## dawg53

seminolewind said:


> Thanks, Dawg. I know it's a virus but those things have been there for a long time. Like a few months. Oh well.


I've dealt with fowl pox. It went through my flock rather quickly and cleared up in about one month, except for my White Rock rooster. It took about 2.5 months to clear up with him. Normally fowl pox progresses slowly through a flock. I think the only reason it spread quickly was due to alot of infected mosquitos in wet weather that particular year. Honestly Karen, I've never seen fowl pox nodules that look like what your roo has. My first thought was some type of tumors.


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## casportpony

If you decide to euthanize him, please do call Dr. P at Tulare CAHFS lab, I'm sure he'd be willing to waive the out of state fee.


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## seminole wind

dawg53 said:


> I've dealt with fowl pox. It went through my flock rather quickly and cleared up in about one month, except for my White Rock rooster. It took about 2.5 months to clear up with him. Normally fowl pox progresses slowly through a flock. I think the only reason it spread quickly was due to alot of infected mosquitos in wet weather that particular year. Honestly Karen, I've never seen fowl pox nodules that look like what your roo has. My first thought was some type of tumors.


My vet diagnosed them as well. These are all pox


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## seminole wind

There are several strains. I think I like the strain that's the little black scabs. After weighing all the info, I decided to pull them off. Just the DRy ones. They were interfering with his eyes and nostrils. It bled very little. I washed his face with some no burn soap and water. Patted dry, snipped all the hair around his face and eyes. Then coated everything with bacitracin/neomycin. He looked like he had infected eyes. It was good to coat his face with that stuff. I took him back and he headed for the water and drank. I removed all food and water and scrubbed bowls out with Clorox . The coop he is in has a top coop and a bottom wired in area which is where he is quarantined due to the open wounds. The area got limed and raked as well as around the coop. He got his own food and water. Then I got my horse spray out and sprayed the perimeter of the section he's in and sprayed the wire as well. I'll spray that every day.

A bit later he was sitting on the feed bowl eating away. 

I ordered pox vaccine, but am not sure if I should vaccinate everyone.

Another picture I found


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## dawg53

The first pic looks kinda like what your roo has. You've taken superb biosecurity precautions, that's for sure!
You're right, there are different strains of fowl pox. The vaccine is only for preventing fowl pox, but not the other strains such as canary pox, turkey pox and so on. Here's a link with general guidelines for using the fowl pox vaccine, scroll down in the link: Hope it helps.
http://www.hyline.com/aspx/redbook/redbook.aspx?s=5&p=35


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## seminole wind

Thanks. I guess my biggest concern right now is for the 10 six month old silkies. 

I think if he gets his face dirty where he is, I'll move him onto my patio. 
He was hungry this morning. (where's my scale, LOL)


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## seminole wind

I wonder if there are others that have had chickens with pox like this. Would be nice to hear from them.


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## casportpony

seminolewind said:


> I wonder if there are others that have had chickens with pox like this. Would be nice to hear from them.


I had pox in 2013 and all looked like these:
https://www.google.com/search?q=avi...=off&tbm=isch&q=avian+pox+in+chickens&imgrc=_


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## seminole wind

I had seen those pictures. Lot's of different pox. I do believe that immune system has a lot to do with what the pox do. 

Well I took a look at Strudel's face and it's all scabbed over. So I just put some more Bacitracin on it. I'll get pics.


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## casportpony

Maybe you vet could consult with Dr. P? I'm sure Dr. P would be willing to talk to him.


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## seminole wind

I'm not sure anything would be different. I've read everything I could find. I'll hit the big book tonight. I read a good article last night. I'll post it. I think I'll move him onto the patio to the hospital cage and start him on abx. How well does Baytril work and would it be a benefit to use Baytril or Amoxi/sulfadimethoxine? I have both. I might have some LS-50 as well. Can I give vitamins with that too?


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## seminole wind

I have tonight's pics. I moved him on the patio in a hutch with shavings, gave him food water, antibiotics , vitamins and an egg with bread chunks. If he doesn't drink by tomorrow I'll tube some medicated water. Pox can make them not feel good.


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## dawg53

Poor boy. He looks miserable. That must be a severe strain of pox, good grief.


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## seminole wind

I agree. I read that you can remove those dried "scabs" but then you have to watch for infection. I had a Polish over a year ago that had huge black pox, like the type we see, but all over his face and he was miserable sick. They did clear up .
But this has been here for months.


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## casportpony

I really don't think it's pox.


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## casportpony

If it is pox, it will go away.


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## seminole wind

Yea, but as in math, we have to figure in 7.5 years old, and Marek's exposed since 6 years ago. So we are not talking about a young healthy chicken. I still have not found an explanation from a trusted resource . I have my explanation, and the vet dx'd him with fowl pox. I will keep hunting.


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## seminole wind

Kathy, can you give me his email or something, I can mail him a few bumps on ice and pictures.


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## seminole wind

He is really sick.


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## seminole wind

I found some more interesting pictures in my travels:


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## casportpony

seminolewind said:


> Kathy, can you give me his email or something, I can mail him a few bumps on ice and pictures.


Did I forget to include his email address when I sent you his contact info? On the iPad today, so will re-send his contact info when I can get on the computer.


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## casportpony

seminolewind said:


> He is really sick.


So sorry... Will you tube feed him?


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## casportpony

seminolewind said:


> I found some more interesting pictures in my travels:


 I remember both of those hens. I think the black hen had an eye infection under the scabs.


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## casportpony

That black hen was the one with the eye infection.


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## casportpony

That pus was under the scabs.


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## seminole wind

I am tube feeding. I'm mixing egg with some Revive because it has a great dose of vitamin c. And I'm giving him Baytril. I'm making him oatmeal.

I never knew that you had such a Bad problem with pox. Between you and Dawg on this 245 post thread about pox, there was more good advice and support than anywhere else I found on the net. There are some really nasty cases on there .

I didn't know how sick they could feel with this stuff. Must be like shingles. I had a rash on my lower back, but for 10 days I felt like someone kicked me in the ribs with a combat boot, and I could barely move in the morning.

I wonder if I should give him an aspirin?


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## seminole wind

His eye is bubbling.


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## dawg53

I have to consider myself lucky when my birds had pox, it was a mild strain...nothing like what yall have dealt with.


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## seminole wind

I thought mine was bad, but from what I've seen, I've seen plenty that look just as bad. Many on Kathy's pox thread that now spans 2 years! 

Good thing my investigating on Yahoo search led me to that thread. Very useful information and seems to be a popular subject.


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## casportpony

Those were a few bad months for me... Had so many, some w/dry pox, some w/wet and dry, some with just wet. I bought the vaccine, but never got around to giving it. Note that the pictures of mine in that thread were the really severe cases... I saw no point in catching anything with just a few bumps, lol. OMG, I went thru so much Kaytee, literally several pounds of it!


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## seminole wind

Kathy, you are such a wealth of information, you shouldn't be so hesitant/reluctant/shy about posting it  . People love to hear about you dealing with anything  . Right, wrong, or questionable, there's so many people who want to know what you did and the outcomes. 

I would love more of your thoughts, ideas, what worked , what didn't work, you are so good at that. Share your experiences. 
I would rather hear what you went thru . The stuff posted on line is good but seems to be the same stuff repeated over and over.


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## casportpony

seminolewind said:


> Kathy, you are such a wealth of information, you shouldn't be so hesitant/reluctant/shy about posting it  . People love to hear about you dealing with anything  . Right, wrong, or questionable, there's so many people who want to know what you did and the outcomes.
> 
> I would love more of your thoughts, ideas, what worked , what didn't work, you are so good at that. Share your experiences.
> I would rather hear what you went thru . The stuff posted on line is good but seems to be the same stuff repeated over and over.


How sweet of you... I guess maybe I should write a summary of my pox experience and what I would do differently next time.


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## seminole wind

You know, you could probably copy and paste some exerts -and add your thoughts. Might save you a lot of writing, LOL


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## casportpony

seminolewind said:


> You know, you could probably copy and paste some exerts -and add your thoughts. Might save you a lot of writing, LOL


I'll have to re-read that thread, lol.


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## seminole wind

Hubby and I just went out and vaccinated 36 chickens for pox. I think I have to wait so many days and check to see if they took. I started with the silkies (cleanest). One Polish roo screamed bloody murder like the warning for an air raid, LOL.

I read wait 2 weeks.


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## seminole wind

I stuck hubby by accident. Will he die or get pox?


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## Alaskan

I am thinking of all sorts of funny... Inappropriate and unhelpful things.


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## seminole wind

Alaskan said:


> I am thinking of all sorts of funny... Inappropriate and unhelpful things.


 I may think of a few too.


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## dawg53

seminolewind said:


> I stuck hubby by accident. Will he die or get pox?


You'll know soon enough Karen!


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## seminole wind

dawg53 said:


> You'll know soon enough Karen!


 Where's my rolling on the floor laughing smilies?

That's pure gross, poor guy


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## seminole wind

Kathy I weighed him this morning and he weighs 1480. So I don't think he weighed 1080 yesterday. I weighed him 3 times to make sure this morning.

How much should I give him daily? Like how many ml? It appears that his saliva is kind of thick.


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## casportpony

seminolewind said:


> Kathy I weighed him this morning and he weighs 1480. So I don't think he weighed 1080 yesterday. I weighed him 3 times to make sure this morning.
> 
> How much should I give him daily? Like how many ml? It appears that his saliva is kind of thick.


At that weight, which I rounded up to 1500 grams, the minimum I would give is 35ml and the absolute max would be 75ml.


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## seminole wind

So that would be between 105 and 225 a day? (3 feedings)?

I went to Walmart and got betadine because the iodine was made from ammonia and it smelled strong. I bought a baby bulb syringe to clear his mouth. 

I'm wondering if he's feeling slightly better because instead of being in the nest I made (horse feed pan), he's roosting on the side. aND his poo turned from the green of death to brown and a bit more substance. 

Tubing really stresses him out. I hate stressing him out. I've never had a bird fight so hard.


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## seminole wind

dawg53 said:


> You'll know soon enough Karen!


Ican't get him to look at it!


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## seminole wind

Today's weight was 1520. He looked awful this morning, but then I made him some mash and he was really attacking that! First time I've seen him eat since this started.


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## Alaskan

Eating is a very good sign.


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## seminole wind

Yea I think so. I think the tubing really stresses him.


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## casportpony

Eating is a good sign as are roosting and poo color change.


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## seminole wind

He must have chowed down this morning. he ate about 2 ounces of food. He still looks like ca-ca, but eating does seem optimistic. Bulb suctioning seems to be a good thing. Last night he fought the tubing so hard I think he passed out (completely limp with neck hanging) but revived right away. I once inadvertently scared a Polish hen and she passed out, LOL.


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## casportpony

seminolewind said:


> He must have chowed down this morning. he ate about 2 ounces of food. He still looks like ca-ca, but eating does seem optimistic. Bulb suctioning seems to be a good thing. Last night he fought the tubing so hard I think he passed out (completely limp with neck hanging) but revived right away. I once inadvertently scared a Polish hen and she passed out, LOL.


Is it possible that when holding him you are restricting the blood flow in his jugular?


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## seminole wind

I don't think so but you never know. I'll watch out for how I handle him. Usually I try to support him under his crop.


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## seminole wind

Kathy, do they all fight you real bad when you tube them?


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## casportpony

seminolewind said:


> Kathy, do they all fight you real bad when you tube them?


Every now and then one will struggle a little. I think the hardest part about tubing is figuring out the best way to restrain them. When I tube I sit on something close to the ground so my thighs are parallel to the ground. Then I place the bird in my lap with it's head pointed to the right. Left arm presses bird against my body while left hand holds head and neck up. Left fingers open beak, right hand inserts tube and empties syringe.


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## seminole wind

That's MOL what I do plus I have a towel wrapped around them. 
I don't think that Strudel is doing well. He sits with his eyes closed.


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## casportpony

seminolewind said:


> That's MOL what I do plus I have a towel wrapped around them.
> I don't think that Strudel is doing well. He sits with his eyes closed.


Eyes closed, that's not good.


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## Alaskan

Oh no! That is a bad sign! So sorry!


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## seminole wind

Today eyes closed, laying down. I gave him 30 ml of vodka and held him till he died. It took 1 1/2 hours. It's very sad when a roo has been with you so long. 7.5 years. Had friends, had girlfriends , had offspring. He had a very happy life. Thanks for the support. This picture was in his younger days.


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## pinkmartin

I haven't been commenting but have been checking in on the thread. Im so sorry for your loss. You were doing an awesome job caring for him.

Edit to fix really bad spelling


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## casportpony

So sorry! {{{{ hugs}}}}


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## Alaskan

Oh dear! He was such a handsome fellow!


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## robin416

Sorry, Sem, I know it's hard when they've been a part of your life for so long.


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## dawg53

Sorry you lost him Karen. He had 7.5 years of the good life.


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## seminole wind

Thanks. He did have a really good life


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