# Like Father...... like daughter?



## ReTIRED (Mar 28, 2013)

Noting that the Rooster carries 2 genes to the mating and the Hen apparently carries just ONE....
Can it reliably be said that a pullet will more likely carry characteristics of her Father ( Rooster) than her Mother ( Hen).....or does this idea NOT apply?

Most of us have heard the phrase "_Useless as the teats on a Boar-Hog."
_Well...it turns out that it isn't _USELESS_....because the female offspring of that Boar-Hog will have the same number of teats as her Father. _So...._in selecting a Boar for breeding....one would select a Boar with many teats. _Interesting_, I think.

-ReTIRED-


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## JC17 (Apr 4, 2013)

ReTIRED said:


> Noting that the Rooster carries 2 genes to the mating and the Hen apparently carries just ONE....
> Can it reliably be said that a pullet will more likely carry characteristics of her Father ( Rooster) than her Mother ( Hen).....or does this idea NOT apply?
> 
> Most of us have heard the phrase "Useless as the teats on a Boar-Hog."
> ...


Genetics is fascinating. I love learning about it in school; it's one of my favorite subjects.


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## ReTIRED (Mar 28, 2013)

*Yes. *I also find Genetics very interesting.
_Unfortunately...._MY "schooling" was totally unrelated to this Subject.
So....I'm rather "In-the-Dark" on most of it.
-ReTIRED-


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## Roslyn (Jun 21, 2012)

Some years ago I had a barred rock hen go broody. She sat on eggs that were ALL from barred rock females. My best guess by looking at the eggs were there were 3 different females laying the eggs in her nest. They were only barred rocks because that is all I had laying eggs outside of the chicken coop. At the time I had barred rocks, one partridge rocks and nothing else laying brown eggs. I had one rooster, a Delaware (full breed Delaware).

5 peeps hatched. There was ONLY one rooster, the Delaware. Three peeps looked like barred rock peeps, and two peeps looked like Delaware peeps. It turned out that only one peep was female, a barred rock. When they grew up the two Delaware peeps became the spitting image of their Daddy, one even crows exactly like him. The three barred rocks looked like barred rock crosses. They were a lighter grey barred instead of the dark charcoal black with barred. All from barred rock females, all had the same daddy, yet only two looked like Delawares.

I think it may be something in the genes because Barred Rock is one of the breeds that was crossed with a New Hampshire back in the 40's to create the Delaware breed, so barred is in the genes.

I have a book on poultry breeding from the 1920's. It's an interesting read.


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## ReTIRED (Mar 28, 2013)

Roslyn said:


> Some years ago I had a barred rock hen go broody. She sat on eggs that were ALL from barred rock females. My best guess by looking at the eggs were there were 3 different females laying the eggs in her nest. They were only barred rocks because that is all I had laying eggs outside of the chicken coop. At the time I had barred rocks, one partridge rocks and nothing else laying brown eggs. I had one rooster, a Delaware (full breed Delaware).
> 
> 5 peeps hatched. There was ONLY one rooster, the Delaware. Three peeps looked like barred rock peeps, and two peeps looked like Delaware peeps. It turned out that only one peep was female, a barred rock. When they grew up the two Delaware peeps became the spitting image of their Daddy, one even crows exactly like him. The three barred rocks looked like barred rock crosses. They were a lighter grey barred instead of the dark charcoal black with barred. All from barred rock females, all had the same daddy, yet only two looked like Delawares.
> 
> ...


That IS interesting.


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## mjs500doo (May 6, 2013)

In my flock I would say the roo contributes a huge factor into the next generation. Even more so than the hens.


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## Roslyn (Jun 21, 2012)

Here are photos. The first is a$$hole, I don't have a photo of the other barred rock brother, but he looked just the same, only he was larger and more "dense", but the same coloring.

The second photo is Angus, he has all Delaware traits, no barred rock at all. He has the coloring of his Uncle George (Pepper's hatch brother). The other Delaware is Hamish, and he is a carbon copy of his Daddy, color, feathering etc.

They all have the same daddy, and barred rock mum.


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## Roslyn (Jun 21, 2012)

This is Hamish.


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## Roslyn (Jun 21, 2012)

Photo #1 is Pepper. He is the Daddy of the four roosters in question.

Photo #2 is George, he was Pepper's brother and to date, my favorite rooster of all time. Miss him.


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## Itsacutefuzzball (Mar 16, 2013)

Ya know, a hole actually looks good for his name!


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## kjohnstone (Mar 30, 2013)

I would tend to disagree on the 2/1 gene mix, just from what I think I know about genetics. In the warm-blooded world, genes are generally paired, with offspring getting 1 part of each parents pairs to make their own pair. That amounts to 4 possible combos from any gene pair. If one parent is "homozygous" that means that each gene in the pair are the same, so it will breed true. If they are "heterozygous" that means that the genes on each side of the pair are different. Then there is the additional genetics of mitochondrial dna, which doesn't so much control the finished critter as the makeup of the cells themselves. In live-bearing species, this generally comes from the mother, though occassionally the zygote will have the father's m-dna, (if the same as the mother's, no problem, if not the same as the mother's, they are usually miscarried, perhaps an incompatibility with mom and thus a rejection like a poorly matched transplant?) I'm not sure how that would work in an externally gestated environment like an egg...???

[wasp genetics are totally mind blowing! True hive queens have the regular pair, as do the drone/males. However, in the spring, when a young queen emerges from winter pupae and builds her nest, she at first produces single dna offspring cloned from herself. If something happens happens to the nest and the queen, any workers with the single gene can go on, build nests and clone themselves, and if they meet a rare male, they can breed and before winter comes they can produce eggs for true queens and males, ensuring their gene lines continue and yet allow for the revitalization and evolution allowed with the paired system. They seem to be able to choose what offspring they produce. At least, that's how I understand it]


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## ReTIRED (Mar 28, 2013)

*Angus* looks _VERY SIMILAR_ to a Red Sex-Link Rooster (probably a "Golden Comet") that I had named: *Oro Blanco de Gallo*.










*Pepper *looks _SIMILAR_ to a "Rhodebar" rooster. (autosexing)
*GOOD PICTURES** !!!

*-ReTIRED-


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## ReTIRED (Mar 28, 2013)

kjohnstone said:


> I would tend to disagree on the 2/1 gene mix, just from what I think I know about genetics. In the warm-blooded world, genes are generally paired, with offspring getting 1 part of each parents pairs to make their own pair. That amounts to 4 possible combos from any gene pair. If one parent is "homozygous" that means that each gene in the pair are the same, so it will breed true. If they are "heterozygous" that means that the genes on each side of the pair are different. Then there is the additional genetics of mitochondrial dna, which doesn't so much control the finished critter as the makeup of the cells themselves. In live-bearing species, this generally comes from the mother, though occassionally the zygote will have the father's m-dna, (if the same as the mother's, no problem, if not the same as the mother's, they are usually miscarried, perhaps an incompatibility with mom and thus a rejection like a poorly matched transplant?) I'm not sure how that would work in an externally gestated environment like an egg...???
> 
> [wasp genetics are totally mind blowing! True hive queens have the regular pair, as do the drone/males. However, in the spring, when a young queen emerges from winter pupae and builds her nest, she at first produces single dna offspring cloned from herself. If something happens happens to the nest and the queen, any workers with the single gene can go on, build nests and clone themselves, and if they meet a rare male, they can breed and before winter comes they can produce eggs for true queens and males, ensuring their gene lines continue and yet allow for the revitalization and evolution allowed with the paired system. They seem to be able to choose what offspring they produce. At least, that's how I understand it]


*Karen,
*Does the "wasp genetics" also hold true for honey-bees ?
( It's a very interesting adaptation ! )
-ReTIRED-


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## kjohnstone (Mar 30, 2013)

!!Always learning, and replacing my wrong knowledge with right knowledge!! just found this! "Chickens have 78 chromosomes. They are diploid animals, therefore the body cell chromosomes are grouped together in pairs- 39. For example, a chicken will have two Chromosome 1's, two chromosome 2's, two chromosome 3's, etc. The exception is the sex-chromosomes, Z and W, where roosters have two Z chromosomes and hens have only one Z chromosome, plus one W chromosome." (still a pair, though...me)(sounds kind of like opposite to human, where it's XX for female and XY for male)... http://www.edelras.nl/chickengenetics/theory.html ... btw, humans have only 23 pairs... making us perhaps less interesting than chickens?


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## kjohnstone (Mar 30, 2013)

ReTIRED said:


> *Karen,
> *Does the "wasp genetics" also hold true for honey-bees ?
> ( It's a very interesting adaptation ! )
> -ReTIRED-


I don't know!!! I read something when I was just a little pullet, that occasionally a worker bee might produce an offspring... So much of what I learned young has been found to be wrong, but the wasp thing is much newer.


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## kjohnstone (Mar 30, 2013)

also a btw, do you remember hearing about the mule that gave birth a couple of years back? Genetic testing proved the baby (male) was hers, apparently fathered by a jack that she was pastured with, and according to gene-pair count, the baby is all jack. Supposedly the two of them now belong to some university for study. Baby is still bound to have horse genes... sire for a new breed of donkey???? I live in the general region where that happened, probably no more than 100 miles away.


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## kjohnstone (Mar 30, 2013)

ReTIRED said:


> *Angus* looks _VERY SIMILAR_ to a Red Sex-Link Rooster (probably a "Golden Comet") that I had named: *Oro Blanco de Gallo*.-ReTIRED-


Very cool on so many levels "*Oro Blanco de Gallo*" - very winey name, including the brand Gallo, and yet "Gallus" being a part of the latin nomenclature for chickens....did you do that on purpose?????


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## Roslyn (Jun 21, 2012)

Itsacutefuzzball said:


> Ya know, a hole actually looks good for his name!


He earned his name lock, stock and barrel !!

He is fine with people, but he is NOT happy with his place in the flock and picks fights with the other boys at every chance. That photo was the day after Cocky Rocky took him down (yet again). He has been sparing with Angus this week, but just bickering, no blood (yet).

He's good with the girls though.


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