# Thrush



## seminole wind (Aug 22, 2015)

This morning pox man's whole upper pallet and sides of his mouth were white. I tried to take pictures, but I will have to take better ones later.


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## Alaskan (Aug 22, 2015)

And the smell? What did it smell like? Anything like beer or really bad beer?


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## casportpony (Aug 22, 2015)

How long has he been on Baytril? Might be a good idea to start the Nystatin and maybe try to find some Ketoconazole or Fluconazole. According to Plumb's, the Nystatin dose is 300,000 IU/kg every 12 hours. No drug intereactions mentioned.


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## seminole wind (Aug 22, 2015)

Okay,I have a 15 year supply of Nystatin from hubby last year, LOL. It's a white coating, and he's got a foamy mouth. I don't know if he's been swallowing. He's on Baytril as of this morning, and he's gotten 2 doses of Nystatin so far, but I'll have to check the date.

He was on sulfadi/amoxi for a few days but now he has a foamy eye, so that's why I switched to Baytril.

Al, it smells like foul watered down beer, but not a nice smell at all. 

Kathy, I've been so hell bent on meds and treatments, I forgot the most important thing that you keep reminding people (like me). Supportive care. Hydration and calories, like he's been getting but he's sick, not dying, yet. So I'll be off to petsmart to get some more kaytee. And pick up some iodine or betadine (which one?) 

Idea: I should get one of those baby suction things that people use to clear a baby's throat or nostrils. The round thing. Maybe a few drops of saline and some suctioning. Good idea???? Anything else?


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## casportpony (Aug 22, 2015)

I used iodine on my pox birds, but I would not use it for yeast. I read that Nystatin is not absorbed into the blood stream, so it has to actually touch the yeast to work. It's possible that being on the sulfa/amoxi led to the yeast, but hard to say for sure. 

The way I tube now is different than how I did it a year ago. When I tube now I tube fluids at 2.5% of their body weight, then repeat in 60-90 minutes. If I don't see lots of watery poop in 2-3 hours from the first tubing I do it one more time. This is usually enough to get their organs going again. From then on I tube Kaytee at 3% their body weight 2-3 time a day. Total crop volume is said to be 5%, but one should be very careful if they decide to give that much as the risk of aspiration increases, especially when they are critically ill. 

I know you can do the math, but for those that might be reading this it's this:

2.5% per 100 grams = 2.5ml
3% per 100 grams = 3ml
5% per 100 grams = 5ml

2.5% per 1000 grams = 25ml
3% per 1000 grams = 30ml
5% per 1000 grams = 50ml


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## seminole wind (Aug 22, 2015)

No iodine in mouth. Just on pox.

Kathy, I spent hours on your dose problem the other night. Truth of the matter is that meds have fried my brain really I'm on disability for it. I just can't figure things fast enough and I get anxious and then can't think at all. I'm afraid that people will notice. This is why I quit my job . The judge actually understood the whole thing. So I practice math. But couldn't even figure out the difference between grams and mg last night and had to look it up.


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## casportpony (Aug 22, 2015)

seminolewind said:


> No iodine in mouth. Just on pox.
> 
> Kathy, I spent hours on your dose problem the other night. Truth of the matter is that meds have fried my brain really I'm on disability for it. I just can't figure things fast enough and I get anxious and then can't think at all. I'm afraid that people will notice. This is why I quit my job . The judge actually understood the whole thing. So I practice math. But couldn't even figure out the difference between grams and mg last night and had to look it up.


So sorry. {{{{{ hugs}}}}} Would you like some suggestions on how much to give him? Let me know what he weighs and I suggest a couple options.


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## casportpony (Aug 22, 2015)

You aren't alone! It doesn't come easily for me, and stuff like grams vs milligrams vs micrograms confuse me, too.


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## dawg53 (Aug 25, 2015)

If a bird has wet pox, the lesions can be removed from inside the mouth and iodine applied after lesion removal. There will be bleeding. It's also possible there could be lesions in the esophagus and/or trachea. If that's the case, birds cant swallow feed and will starve, and will suffocate due to blocked trachea.


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## seminole wind (Aug 22, 2015)

dawg53 said:


> If a bird has wet pox, the lesions can be removed from inside the mouth and iodine applied after lesion removal. There will be bleeding. It's also possible there could be lesions in the esophagus and/or trachea. If that's the case, birds cant swallow feed and will starve, and will suffocate due to blocked trachea.


Okay. From what I see it's a white coating in the mouth and throat. Dawg , I will be weighing him every day. True, he could have blockage in his sinuses or trach or esophagus, there's no way to tell if he's not swallowing or can't swallow or it hurts. I can pass a tube .


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## seminole wind (Aug 22, 2015)

casportpony said:


> So sorry. {{{{{ hugs}}}}} Would you like some suggestions on how much to give him? Let me know what he weighs and I suggest a couple options.


Of course I want your help. He weighs about 1080.


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## casportpony (Aug 22, 2015)

seminolewind said:


> Of course I want your help. He weighs about 1080.


At that weight 25 ml should be a safe amount to give. If he vomits, give 20 ml. Weigh first thing in the morning. If he loses weight, increase volume and/or number of feedings. It's okay to feed him several times a day as long as his crop keeps clearing, but with yeast or whatever it is, and the Baytril, his crop might not empty as quickly as it should. Best not to tube after you bed time... This time while you're sleeping will allow his crop to clear 100%. Remember that tube feeding should always be the last thing done, so doctor his bumps, yeast, give meds orally, etc, then tube and put back in cage.


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## casportpony (Aug 22, 2015)

If you've been tubing more than 25 ml, keep doing it. Some of my 1000 gram birds can very easily take 60 ml, but it's always best to start with the smaller amount.


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## seminole wind (Aug 22, 2015)

Thanks. He's taking 40 x3 today no problem and crop empties in between. Will do.


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