# Muddy gene pool with split?



## Jim (Sep 26, 2012)

I have a black split to lavender rooster (English Orpington if it matters). I am thinking of reducing one pen and combining all my BBS Orpingtons, including the two black split hens and one black split rooster. The wife is concerned with muddying the BBS gene pool with a copy of the lavender, especially on the blues. Anyone have any experience or knowledge to back it up either way!


Jim


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## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

She's right. Now let's see if I can remember how this goes. The blacks are probably carrying a copy of the lavender gene. The issue is, you don't know who. Inadvertently put two birds together carrying the lavender gene and you could have surprises popping up.

Putting blue with black made it almost impossible to find true blacks. Putting birds potentially carrying the lavender gene and not revealing that has messed up more than one breeding pen. 

I understand it but I stink when it comes to explaining it.


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## Fiere (Feb 26, 2014)

I never understood the difference between achieving the lavender (self blue) and the BBS gene. I know they are different, that is why I will not get ever get "true lavender" australorps in my BBS pens even though I can achieve a very light blue if I truly desired. The genes would just be dictating the shade of the true blue, not the true self blue gene.

So if I am correct in my understanding, if you have a black lavender split, and you put it in a BBS pen, you are adding a fourth gene to the group, which would indeed muddy it, as now you are working with Black, Black Lavender Split, Blue, and Splash. I have no clue what the outcome of this would be, however, as I don't fully understand the genetics behind self blue.


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## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

This is from a Silkie perspective since that's what I raised. Black should not be introduced to blues or splash pens. Its created such a dark blue that its black. True blacks are needed in breeding pens for things like the lavenders or self blue. And for the paints. I imagine in other breeds this same would be true for improving a breeding line. 

There are still a lot of questions about the lavender gene. And you hit on it, are you looking at a very light blue or are you looking at a lavender? Again, Silkies and I've seen this in other breeds, the body is lighter than the head and neck in blue. In lavender the bird is pretty much all one color. I had a couple that had slightly darker shading in wing and tail feathers but for the most part the color is even throughout. 

From there it goes in to the alphabet soup. And I still stink at explaining it. Its there in my brain but getting it out is another matter.


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## piglett (Jun 21, 2012)

Jim said:


> I have a black split to lavender rooster (English Orpington if it matters). I am thinking of reducing one pen and combining all my BBS Orpingtons, including the two black split hens and one black split rooster. The wife is concerned with muddying the BBS gene pool with a copy of the lavender, especially on the blues. Anyone have any experience or knowledge to back it up either way!
> 
> Jim


i went with a splash rooster this year for breeding my BBS orps

i got some great splash offspring but my blues are not much to look at (too dark)

next season i'll put a blue roo in with my girls

some nice light blue laced offspring should be the result


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## Jim (Sep 26, 2012)

In my BBS Pen, I prefer a true blue! But, a few of my black split hens, I have thought about moving and ding away with my lavender project, but, if they won't work as well, might as well stick to that project another year!


Jim


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## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

Yep, if you want to experiment a bit more. You can still get good money for the black splits since chances are high they are carrying the lavender gene.


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