# BUCKEYES - The Perfect Homestead Fowl



## cgmccary

Buckeyes are a perfect homestead fowl. They are very active foragers and when free ranged, they require very little feed. I free range mine and they cover my pastures well. They are superb at breaking up the manure in the pasture. Some of my Buckeyes have taken to following the cattle and picking off those pesky horseflies. I have even seen mine jumping up and taking the fly off the cow.


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## Apyl

The more I read about this breed the more I would like to add some to my flock. I dont have pasture for them but do have 2+ acres of blackberries, huckle berry, and blueberries plus lots of vegitation and woods. Of course I will be waiting until spring to add to my flock now that we are getting into fall here in Wisconsin. Time will tell I suppose, but so far I like what I see and read.


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## Sundancers

I did look at them, once upon a time. 

And I agree they would make a great homestead fowl.


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## Energyvet

What you describe is in The Omnivores Dilemma by Michael Pollin. He describes this perfect farm and the chickens follow the cows in a chicken wagon from pasture to pasture. Every 3 days they switch. It's how nature was intended. Beautiful.


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## cgmccary

> What you describe is in The Omnivores Dilemma by Michael Pollin. He describes this perfect farm and the chickens follow the cows in a chicken wagon from pasture to pasture. Every 3 days they switch. It's how nature was intended. Beautiful.


I agree & a very good book.

Another excellent book is _The Small-Scale Poultry Flock, An all natural approach to raising chickens and other fowl for home and market growers, (2011)_ by *Harvey Ussery (Chelsea Green Publishing, ISBN 9781603582902)*. I highly recommend the book to anyone seriously breeding poultry on the small scale and wanting to contribute to your breed. Ussery covers a wide range of topics in very good detail. Like me. Ussery utilizes broody hens to hatch and rear his birds. I use my Buckeye hens and find they make great broodies. I also use Game hens. With the Game hens, I can turn out in the open as they fiercely protect their young. A Buckeye hen, I pen with her young as she will allow me to pick them up (i.e. the Buckeye hen will rush at me but fall short of attacking me vs. a game hen will ferociously attack me). On the other hand, I like the Buckeye because she can cover more eggs & she readily accepts more chicks - I had a Buckeye hen that took 24 chicks. I notice that Ussery uses a LF breed X with a Game hen and finds them effective as broodies as well-- A hen raising chicks is as nature intended. Broodiness is ALWAYS lurking (hidden) in the chicken genes and cannot be completely stamped out.

Here are Buckeye hens going to the compost pile:


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## Energyvet

Pretty buckeye hens. Thanks for the reference. I'll act on it as soon as I can. It is exactly what I'm looking for.


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## BuckeyeChickens

Glad to see you found the Chicken Forum, Chris!!! Welcome, aboard we can always use MORE Buckeye fans to sing their praises!!!


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## Riverdale

BuckeyeChickens said:


> Glad to see you found the Chicken Forum, Chris!!! Welcome, aboard we can always use MORE Buckeye fans to sing their praises!!!


Jeff, where can I get some Buckeye chicks? Won't be until next year, but our regular hatchery doesn't raise them.


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## BuckeyeChickens

Riverdale said:


> Jeff, where can I get some Buckeye chicks? Won't be until next year, but our regular hatchery doesn't raise them.


Riverdale, you can check out the American Buckeye Club "Breeder Directory" to find Buckeye breeders in Michigan (and other parts of the USA) or visit my website in January and place an order for hatching eggs or day old chicks!!!

www.crainsrunranch.com

Right now I'm taking orders for fall hatching eggs but I don't ship any chicks until March!!!

Regards,


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## Riverdale

BuckeyeChickens said:


> Riverdale, you can check out the American Buckeye Club "Breeder Directory" to find Buckeye breeders in Michigan (and other parts of the USA) or visit my website in January and place an order for hatching eggs or day old chicks!!!
> 
> www.crainsrunranch.com
> 
> Right now I'm taking orders for fall hatching eggs but I don't ship any chicks until March!!!
> 
> Regards,


One of them is less than 10 miles from me! I'll have to stop one day and see them!


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## BuckeyeChickens

Riverdale said:


> One of them is less than 10 miles from me! I'll have to stop one day and see them!


That's GREAT, I hope you find them to your liking!!! The Buckeye is a tremendous dual pupose fowl for cold climates....Good Luck and keep us posted!!!


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## Pathfindersfarm

Nice rooster Chris.


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## cgmccary

> Nice rooster Chris.


Thanks Laura!


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## cgmccary

13 week old Buckeye cockerels hunting/ chasing horseflies on Dexter cattle:


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## Energyvet

Started out like a ballet.......


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## Apatedolos

Hi guys, just found this place! I'm so wanting to get buckeyes, they are such a pretty type of chicken. I think I joined your yahoo group but can't find the link to it. My old computer crashed. Life is getting so hectic with the kids starting school and all. Oh listen to me ramble. Anyway, hoping to get 6 soon!


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## Pathfindersfarm

There are two Yahoo Groups for Buckeyes.

The one I founded in 2008, and which is the group for the American Buckeye Poultry Club, can be found here: http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/AmericanBuckeyePoultryClub/

The one that was founded in 2009, and is the group for the American Buckeye Club, can be found here: http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/AmericanBuckeyeClub/?yguid=92230821

You can email me at [email protected] for more info.


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## Shumaker

Actually, the ABC was "re-established" May 2008 and the website was launched January 2009....to comemorate the 100th anniversay of the original ABC that was started in 1909!

I encourage everyone to visit the relatively new website; www.americanbuckeyeclub.blogspot.com ; to explore this exception breed of poultry. Many great things are coming in 2013 for the buckeye!


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## RedBird

Nice topic! And I agree, you couldn't find a much better homestead fowl than the Buckeye.

Great job on the new website ABPC! http://www.americanbuckeyepoultryclub.com/


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## Pathfindersfarm

Shumaker said:


> Actually, the ABC was "re-established" May 2008 and the website was launched January 2009....to comemorate the 100th anniversay of the original ABC that was started in 1909!


You can't "re-establish" a breed club that's been dead for decades. What you folks did was pick up a name of a club that had been defunct for years, act like you had some connection to it (you don't), and use it.

Theoretically, you using the old logo is a violation of trademark law. Just fwiw.


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## Shumaker

Pathfindersfarm said:


> You can't "re-establish" a breed club that's been dead for decades.


Who says? Is that one of your "rules"? Go back over to BYC where you and your band of misfits frolic with happy thoughts and magical rainbows! Say what you want....don't worry.....we do!
Furthermore.....trademark violation.......where did you get your law degree?


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## PA_Farmer24

I don't understand all this hatered between these two clubs? WHy is this. Both are trying to help raise awareness of a breed that was and/or is in danger. It is a shame that grown adults need to be like this. While I have heard but cannot confirm 100% that the ABPC is a paid group and the ABC is a group who welcomes anyone to join with no money needed. I have also heard rumors that the governing parties of the ABPC is very touchy when it comes to questions on their birds breed, traits and anything else that a new person may ask? Again I cannot confirm this but only rumors. As for the ABC will give answers to anyone who asks, although some of the answers may offend some the answers are to help people understand the groups goals. Can either of the two groups help me asnwer the question why the fight and can't both of you get a long. 

I don't know which way to go which group to really follow. Please explain your goals to me on both of your groups. SO that I can make the good decision on which group to be a part of. 

Thank You.


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## Shumaker

PA_Farmer24 said:


> I don't understand all this hatered between these two clubs? WHy is this. Both are trying to help raise awareness of a breed that was and/or is in danger. It is a shame that grown adults need to be like this. While I have heard but cannot confirm 100% that the ABPC is a paid group and the ABC is a group who welcomes anyone to join with no money needed. I have also heard rumors that the governing parties of the ABPC is very touchy when it comes to questions on their birds breed, traits and anything else that a new person may ask? Again I cannot confirm this but only rumors. As for the ABC will give answers to anyone who asks, although some of the answers may offend some the answers are to help people understand the groups goals. Can either of the two groups help me asnwer the question why the fight and can't both of you get a long.
> 
> I don't know which way to go which group to really follow. Please explain your goals to me on both of your groups. SO that I can make the good decision on which group to be a part of.
> 
> Thank You.


Cute! Well if you want to learn about buckeyes.....you know where to go! That's it......................you are kicked out and banded forever!


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## DarkRedBird

Pathfindersfarm said:


> You can't "re-establish" a breed club that's been dead for decades. What you folks did was pick up a name of a club that had been defunct for years, act like you had some connection to it (you don't), and use it.
> 
> Theoretically, you using the old logo is a violation of trademark law. Just fwiw.


You and your lawyer are gonna have to take that up with the APA. The American Buckeye Club is a recognized breed club.


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## spatte68

Pathfindersfarm said:


> You can't "re-establish" a breed club that's been dead for decades. What you folks did was pick up a name of a club that had been defunct for years, act like you had some connection to it (you don't), and use it.
> 
> Theoretically, you using the old logo is a violation of trademark law. Just fwiw.


Seriously where do you get this dribble? ABC club is acknowledged and accepted into the APA. We are all striving towards the same goal. Sharing of knowledge and bettering the bird. Why not stop the fighting and learn from the expertise of breeders that know genetics and the true sop for the breed.

Rumors tell me the other club (non abc) ban and don't like anyone to question or discuss logic of breeding/standards. Personally I don't see that as a club with learning capabilities. We may not agree on all points but within a group you should be able to discuss and learn from others that have knowledge.


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## BuffaloGal

PA farmer, did you ever notice, like I have, that all the "hatred" seems to flow from one side only? Speaking of which; Shumaker, that's quite an avatar. I'm curious, do you get up in the morning naturally this creative, or do you have to build up to that level of open hatred by torturing small animals and praying to a goat skull? 



As for ancient history; wasn't Lay a member of the ABPC yahoo group back when they were discussing what name to use for their club? (Hint: It doesn't cost anything to join and read yahoo archives.)


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## Pathfindersfarm

PA_Farmer24 said:


> I don't understand all this hatered between these two clubs? WHy is this. Both are trying to help raise awareness of a breed that was and/or is in danger. It is a shame that grown adults need to be like this. While I have heard but cannot confirm 100% that the ABPC is a paid group and the ABC is a group who welcomes anyone to join with no money needed. I have also heard rumors that the governing parties of the ABPC is very touchy when it comes to questions on their birds breed, traits and anything else that a new person may ask? Again I cannot confirm this but only rumors. As for the ABC will give answers to anyone who asks, although some of the answers may offend some the answers are to help people understand the groups goals. Can either of the two groups help me asnwer the question why the fight and can't both of you get a long.
> 
> I don't know which way to go which group to really follow. Please explain your goals to me on both of your groups. SO that I can make the good decision on which group to be a part of.
> 
> Thank You.


Here are the objectives of the American Buckeye Poultry Club, as outlined in our Bylaws and Constitution (we are a registered Non-Profit, with elected officers and a Board of Directors):

http://www.americanbuckeyepoultryclub.com/Objectives.html

And you can find out more about the club at our newly redesigned website here: http://www.americanbuckeyepoultryclub.com/

And please note, our Facebook and Yahoo groups are open for anyone to read. You can read any of our messages in either, as far back to the beginning.

Our Facebook group can be found here: https://www.facebook.com/groups/AmericanBuckeyePoultryClub/

And our Yahoo Group can be found here: http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/AmericanBuckeyePoultryClub/

And you'll note none of the avatars of our Board members mock anyone, fwiw.


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## Shumaker

BuffaloGal said:


> Speaking of which; Shumaker, that's quite an avatar. I'm curious, do you get up in the morning naturally this creative, or do you have to build up to that level of open hatred by torturing small animals and praying to a goat skull?


Actually, that was the case.....woke right up and there it was . Like a beacon from heaven. That took me a long time to make. I've got several others and making more daily...would you like me to share? Torturing animals, praying to a goat skull? I'll have to try that out......sounds fun! What do you know......we just had a baby goat a couple days ago. I'll let you know how it goes! 

Anyone with a sense of humor, might actually find that avatar humorous. But I suppose humor is not for everyone, that's why BYC was created....Right?!?!?!?!

I appreciate history lessons and some things never change.....never think outside the box and always enjoy the served kool-aide to remain within. I just don't think Jeff is that kind of guy and wasn't that before that ABPC "click" was stood up or actually recognized?


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## BuffaloGal

You misunderstand, I *do* find your artwork humorous in a childishly obvious way. It's perfect for you.

I don't know what "kind of guy" Jeff is, but I do know that according to the archives from May 2008, he had not "founded" anything.
http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/AmericanBuckeyePoultryClub/message/161


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## Shumaker

BuffaloGal said:


> You misunderstand, I *do* find your artwork humorous in a childishly obvious way. It's perfect for you.


Thank you, your so sweet. I never knew you had a soft side?


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## Pathfindersfarm

Actually, I think it's safe to say that both clubs have members who are knowledgeable about poultry, avian genetics, chicken husbandry, and Buckeyes in particular. I think both clubs have members who are interested in helping others learn more about the breed and assist them with obtaining good quality stock. I think members in both clubs have good quality stock that they make available to others at all levels, both free and low-priced to 4-H kids, and show quality high-end birds at higher prices to those who seek them.

In fact, in many ways, there are more similarities between many members of both clubs than there are differences.

What there are, and what you see in public forums such as this, are personality differences. Different members do rub against each other, and not always in good ways. Sometimes we just can't help poke each other with sticks. Joe pokes us with his avatar. I get irritated, and make snarky reference to their questionable use of an old logo.

I suppose we should all learn to shut up and just ignore each other. But I can only have the olive branch thrown back in my face so many times before I tire of it you see. But yes, we should all get along. And I apologize for being testy earlier. It's been a very long week, and perhaps we should all knock off and go get some beers. Where's the emoticon for a beer, I wonder?


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## Shumaker

Pathfinder........a beer is a great idea. I'm sorry.....I'm a smart ass and couldn't resist. I agree with pretty much everything you have said. But this is funny.......in a childish sort of way according to Ms. Buffalo. When/if we ever cross paths at a show, you'll see that I like living for the moment. I will introduce myself just as I did with Chris. Don't spit on me even though I probably deserve it. It is a clear case of difference in personality and everybody thinks differently. I pick at people, I have since I was at a young age. A trait my father taught me; good or bad...it's fun!I'm sure both groups are serious about their birds....but life is way too short and the everyday grind (in comparison) is not all that much fun. These pics are not going to change someones mind or hurt the breed. How can it? If you are doing what you love to do and enjoy the birds and the people.....it only promotes the breed you are passionate about! Yes, they are mocking your groups logo, but I'm doing the same to ours by changing it.

I have to go feed in the nasty, no good, no fun, cold snow! Yeah


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## Pathfindersfarm

Ok, I have to say, I laughed at that. And no, when we meet at a show (and you know we will one day) I will not spit on you Joe, just not something I do. But be prepared for me to have my birds in top form, and to do my level best to kick your ass.


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## Marengoite

Pathfindersfarm said:


> I suppose we should all learn to shut up and just ignore each other. But I can only have the olive branch thrown back in my face so many times before I tire of it you see. But yes, we should all get along. And I apologize for being testy earlier. It's been a very long week, and perhaps we should all knock off and go get some beers. Where's the emoticon for a beer, I wonder?


Olive branch? So does that mean Karen and I are reinstated as members of your Yahoo group? Does that mean you will allow us to post in it? Does this mean that you'll restore all the posts you deleted? Does that mean you won't moderate our posts? Does that mean you'll reinstate all the people you kicked out of the Facebook group who never posted anything inflammatory in the group, but were removed largely because they were active members of the ABC Facebook group?

Just wondering what form this olive branch is taking other than asking me to drive 150 miles and sit down for a face to face meeting with your husband present. I guess maybe if you wouldn't spank us with the olive branch in the first place, you'd be less inclined to get it tossed back.


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## cgmccary

A Buckeye Cock at the door of his coop which I open each morning for him to take his hens free ranging . . .


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## duckman050

Hi I just got my first buckeye tonight he is a little skiddish an I will have pics tomarrow but he was fed corn all winter so far and his feathers arnt the best any ideas on how to fix them up so they look better for when he goes to show later on.


Chicken and duck man


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## BuckeyeChickens

duckman050 said:


> Hi I just got my first buckeye tonight he is a little skiddish an I will have pics tomarrow but he was fed corn all winter so far and his feathers arnt the best any ideas on how to fix them up so they look better for when he goes to show later on.


Congrats and Welcome Duckman! Best thing you can do for your new Buckeye is start feeding him a good 20-22% "Grower" ration that has animal, bone or fish meal protein! I use one that comes from our local Rural King called "Meatbird" and it is 22% protein. Buckeyes don't stop growing until they get thru their second full year, even a 3 year old Cock can put on a little muscle! The higher protein feed is good for their feathering as well. Good Luck and post some pics when you have a chance!


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## seminole wind

This is an old thread, but I've always wondered what the attraction was with Buckeyes. The other thing that this thread reminded me of is why do Buckeye owners seem to have arguments over the breed etc, more than any other group? They get really vicious too.

Anyone have Buckeyes?


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## Nm156

I have 1.And yes these threads are terrible.


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## cgmccary

> seminolewind: This is an old thread, but I've always wondered what the attraction was with Buckeyes. The other thing that this thread reminded me of is why do Buckeye owners seem to have arguments over the breed etc, more than any other group? They get really vicious too.
> 
> Anyone have Buckeyes?


You must have never owned LF Buckeyes. Buckeyes are very friendly, beautiful, great foragers, good meat birds (process at about 16 weeks thereabouts), hardy, and decent egg layer -- perfect dual purpose fowl.

Buckeye breeders are a very passionate bunch. Every breed would benefit from having such passionate breeders. In fact though other breeds do have arguments by their breeders about them: two feuding groups between Orpingtons? Serama groups? RIR? New Hampshires with the German vs. American groups? OEGs? Dominique breeders did not speak for decades in the past (2 groups) and what about the Marans breeders? Have you made the same comment about them? Are you not tuned to those arguments? How are the arguments with the other breeds less heated? Where have you been?

The Buckeye breeders have been quiet for some time now, no arguments I have seen on any thread. Nobody has mentioned anything to me since the Fall of 2014. Funny you are bringing this up when nothing is happening. What do you breed?


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## robin416

This thread should probably be cleaned up so comments are kept on topic. 

CG, if Nm is thinking the way I do, it has more to do with them being nasty to each other. We all recognize sometime passions get just a bit out of hand but there is a time and place and this is not it.

And to add, too bad I didn't learn more about the breed before I got out of poultry. They sound like a breed that would have fit in nicely with my old setup.


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## cgmccary

And my points are: (1) this thread last had a post > two years ago. I have not seen conflict anywhere since ~ the Fall of 2014. (2) Other breed clubs have been worse. The question: "Why do Buckeye owners seem to have arguments over the breed etc, more than any other group?" is not accurate. The premise is not true. Other breed groups have been worse and are still going strong. You have to live in a bubble and be completely out of touch to say, "more than any other group." Nm is not the one who made the comment. seminolewind made the comment. I am not the one who ventured off the topic. I am the OP and did not post anything controversial.

Since I started the thread as the OP. I am perfectly fine deleting the entire thread, all of it. While you're at it, moderators, you can remove me as a member of this forum as well.


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## seminole wind

cgmccary said:


> You must have never owned LF Buckeyes. Buckeyes are very friendly, beautiful, great foragers, good meat birds (process at about 16 weeks thereabouts), hardy, and decent egg layer -- perfect dual purpose fowl.
> 
> Buckeye breeders are a very passionate bunch. Every breed would benefit from having such passionate breeders. In fact though other breeds do have arguments by their breeders about them: two feuding groups between Orpingtons? Serama groups? RIR? New Hampshires with the German vs. American groups? OEGs? Dominique breeders did not speak for decades in the past (2 groups) and what about the Marans breeders? Have you made the same comment about them? Are you not tuned to those arguments? How are the arguments with the other breeds less heated? Where have you been?
> 
> The Buckeye breeders have been quiet for some time now, no arguments I have seen on any thread. Nobody has mentioned anything to me since the Fall of 2014. Funny you are bringing this up when nothing is happening. What do you breed?


At the bottom of posts is suggestions for other threads to read. I saw this one for Buckeyes.

Still curious about the Buckeye thing from another forum, yes I wonder why Buckeyes are such a passionate subject. And yes I have seen more arguments on Buckeye threads. I never said it was a bad thing. I'VE never owned a Buckeye, and my own flock is several different breeds. I don't even follow Buckeyes. At times I've come across the passionate discussions about Buckeyes, and WOULD LIKE TO KNOW WHY! So don't paint me as this evil person who is trying to make trouble. I don't even think this thread should be cleaned up. I appreciate the passion. And I'm curious to know why Buckeyes are worth having heated words over.

Where have I been? I had been in a position to see first hand where the arguments are on a forum and over what. So my observations are not inaccurate and far from being in a bubble.


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## Marengoite

OK, let's assume you have a legitimate question as to why discussions on the Buckeye thread often become heated.

1. It is true that other chicken breeds have their heated discussions. I've watched the RIR folks say things one would never repeat in polite company and the NH crowd as well. Nor is it confined to chickens. If you get any two Quarter Horse owners in a room, you'll have at least 3 opinions as to what the best course for the breed is. Living near the city that hosts the North American Quarter Horse Congress annually, I have seen this on frequent occasions. I had a discussion with a NAVHDA guy about what has happened to Brittanies once the field trialers got hold of them and how the breed has changed over the decades. Every breed seems to have their fans and fanatics. 

2. The substance of the arguments themselves lend themselves to two schools I will call the Preservationists who want to save the breed for posterity and are willing to innovate in the interest of "genetic diversity" and the Restorationists who want to adhere to the original standard and vision of the breed's founder. And of course, there are nuances on this argument, but it boils down to interpretation of the SOP. 

3. Individuals involved in the argument. This is probably the strongest factor affecting the threads. You can name on the fingers of your hand the loudest voices in this argument and still have plenty of fingers left over. PM me if you want names on the scorecard, but I would say this latter is the primary source of contention. I think it is no coincidence that when one individual was kicked off this forum, the arguments abruptly ceased. The same is true of other forums including those on Facebook. Every place this one individual has been banned, peace and contentment have followed in its wake.


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## seminole wind

Thankyou Marengoite. That's a good explanation. I appreciate the reply. I'm sure there are arguments for everything.

Maybe there is one particular person who has done this elsewhere, and not a group argument.


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## Shumaker

I think the thread is fine. It allows people to see the history of the breed and the people breeding them. It offers insight to how the breed SHOULD be bred and allows people interested in the breed to see how views of the breed do differ! There has been plenty of GREAT things happen of recent for the Buckeye. It now has its first ever Grand Master; and the vast majority of the true breeders now see how breed should actually bred. 
There is a vast difference between how the "breeders" of a decade ago and the breeders of today see the breed. The judging has gotten leagues better and the true dark color of the buckeye is being realized.

For great insight into the buckeye and proof that the breed has advanced and doing far better please check out my website. 2015 was a bust due to the avian influenza but I had 5 or 6 buckeyes on Champion row in 2014 (one was Reserve Super Grand Champion of Show but still earned Grand Champion Land fowl) and 2016 has started off with a bang. On March 26, one of my buckeyes was recognized as Class Champion and advanced to Reserve Grand Champion LF. This was the first Buckeye in 2016 to actually WIN a class. The "buckeyes" that the ALBC and like minded propagators peddled are now being see as just barnyard mutts/average somewhat red fowl while Nettie's vision for the breed is finally being realized. Its a great time for the breed and I think the history that is outlined in this forum is important for future enthusiasts that actually do want to do the breed justice!

www.shumakerfarmbuckeyechickens.com


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## Nm156

Well i guess i could turn mine into dog food since i don't see the bars of slate. Therefore he must be a mutt and couldn't win an award.


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## cgmccary

> "I think it is no coincidence that when one individual was kicked off this forum, the arguments abruptly ceased."
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
Click to expand...

It is also no coincidence that when this individual was antagonized on here and kicked off that the rest of you stopped visiting the site on a regular basis. The reason you were here was to antagonize her and get her to respond so the moderators who did not have a clue would kick her off.



> "Every place this one individual has been banned, peace and contentment have followed in its wake."


You are talking about BYC, lol. Who goes there anymore? There are Facebook pages where this "one individual" participates fully and there is no problem because the 4 or 5 of ya'll aren't allowed there so there is no trouble, no friction, thank God.



> "2. The substance of the arguments themselves lend themselves to two schools I will call the Preservationists who want to save the breed for posterity and are willing to innovate in the interest of "genetic diversity" and the Restorationists who want to adhere to the original standard and vision of the breed's founder. And of course, there are nuances on this argument, but it boils down to interpretation of the SOP. "


Hogwash. I must be in neither of the two schools above because neither descriptions fits me. My school is following the SOP's description for the breed and to provide meat & eggs for the table. These are one and the same.

There is the SOP. It has a description for the Buckeye that has remained virtually the same since its APA admittance with some wording changed and better descriptive terms added. There are those who want to change the SOP (re-write the Buckeye description) to suit their birds and then those who want the SOP to stay the same and work toward that description. Those are the two schools. You see these two schools in most every breed.


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## cgmccary

> "On March 26, one of my buckeyes was recognized as Class Champion and advanced to Reserve Grand Champion LF. This was the first Buckeye in 2016 to actually WIN a class."


Really? Aaron and Kara Baker won Class Champion on March 12, 2016 at the Rison, Arkansas show and went on to go further than you. Their Buckeye cockerel was Grand Champion Large Fowl and Reserve Grand Champion of the entire show.


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## robin416

At this point, CG, I'm going to fulfill your desire to be removed from this forum.


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## Shumaker

cgmccary said:


> Really? Aaron and Kara Baker won Class Champion on March 12, 2016 at the Rison, Arkansas show and went on to go further than you. Their Buckeye cockerel was Grand Champion Large Fowl and Reserve Grand Champion of the entire show.


How did you guys do in Ohio?...LOL...the judges here know what time of day it is! I know, I wasn't there but its hard to be in two places at once. The DoD needed me in Dallas. The west (especially California) needs a better class of Buckeye..it would also help they had decent LF numbers..the stuff you sent out there will never make it here in the east where the American class actually hits numbers to be considered a legit class.... Its not hard to beat 8-10 birds especially if you brought 5-6 of the birds in the class....the water gets a little hotter here in the east when the classes are 25-35+ birds.... Judges are recognizing it  Lets debate Chris, you aren't all that great at it. I've left this thread alone because it wasn't getting any attention...no one was chattering but I looked in from time to time.

The virus you mentioned left because she got kicked off....kicked out of pretty much everything except the FB group she created. I can understand why you would want the past erased. I'll be visiting Arkansas and Oklahoma very soon......it'll be fun.


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## Circle_U_Farm

http://americanbuckeyeclub.blogspot.com/p/understanding-sop.html
Here is a great link for anyone interested in breeding or understanding the Buckeye the way their creator, Nettie Metcalf, imagined them.


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## Circle_U_Farm

Because of all the passion/anger the two clubs have had over time, this thread was shut down. I am extremely happy to see it back up and running. Thank you to all who helped make that happen. I will be coming by more often now that there is a place for our Buckeyes again.


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## seminole wind

robin416 said:


> At this point, CG, I'm going to fulfill your desire to be removed from this forum.


I was thinking the exact same thing. 
I don't mind heated discussions or passionate arguments. What I do mind is people that can't give an opinion without bashing someone else's.


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## seminole wind

Circle_U_Farm said:


> Because of all the passion/anger the two clubs have had over time, this thread was shut down. I am extremely happy to see it back up and running. Thank you to all who helped make that happen. I will be coming by more often now that there is a place for our Buckeyes again.


It was me! All I did was ask why Buckeyes incite passionate discussions. 
I for one would like to learn more about Buckeyes. So hopefully those who want this thread running will help keep it productive and well meaning.


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## Marengoite

Nm156 said:


> Well i guess i could turn mine into dog food since i don't see the bars of slate. Therefore he must be a mutt and couldn't win an award.


Depends on what your goals are. If you want a bird that will do well in competition, then that would be your best course of action. If you just want something around the place to lay eggs, you're probably fine.


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## Marengoite

cgmccary said:


> It is also no coincidence that when this individual was antagonized on here and kicked off that the rest of you stopped visiting the site on a regular basis. The reason you were here was to antagonize her and get her to respond so the moderators who did not have a clue would kick her off.


So how does that explain our current participation in this thread?



cgmccary said:


> You are talking about BYC, lol. Who goes there anymore? There are Facebook pages where this "one individual" participates fully and there is no problem because the 4 or 5 of ya'll aren't allowed there so there is no trouble, no friction, thank God.


I thought part of the rules of this forum is that we don't mention other forums by name or post links. For the record, no that is not the only place she was banned.



cgmccary said:


> Hogwash. I must be in neither of the two schools above because neither descriptions fits me. My school is following the SOP's description for the breed and to provide meat & eggs for the table. These are one and the same.
> 
> There is the SOP. It has a description for the Buckeye that has remained virtually the same since its APA admittance with some wording changed and better descriptive terms added. There are those who want to change the SOP (re-write the Buckeye description) to suit their birds and then those who want the SOP to stay the same and work toward that description. Those are the two schools. You see these two schools in most every breed.


I suppose you mean "Hogwash" in the kindest way possible since it appears to be argumentative taunting to me when I read it. So much for everyone being collegial in this discussion.


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## Nm156

SOP or SOuP.............................................


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## robin416

Leave it alone, Margengoite, the situation has been handled. He won't be answering questions from here any more.


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## seminole wind

Circle_U_Farm said:


> http://americanbuckeyeclub.blogspot.com/p/understanding-sop.html
> Here is a great link for anyone interested in breeding or understanding the Buckeye the way their creator, Nettie Metcalf, imagined them.


Thanks for the link!


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## Marengoite

robin416 said:


> Leave it alone, Margengoite, the situation has been handled. He won't be answering questions from here any more.


OK, Robin. Saw your reply after I posted mine.

Have a great day!


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## robin416

Working on it, Marganoite. And no biggie on the posting. 

BTW, since you're participating on this thread would you or could you take a look at NM's bird and tell us what you see? Having those that know a breed giving critiques is very helpful especially when there is a visual example available.


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## CanadianBuckeye

Hi everyone. I'm new here, and new to the Buckeye breed. I've been doing my due diligence as best as I can, and hope to do the breed justice. I have one Buckeye rooster, and three hens. I have some hatching eggs coming from Alberta from another Canadian Buckeye chicken breed enthusiast. Wish me luck!


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## Nm156

CanadianBuckeye said:


> Hi everyone. I'm new here, and new to the Buckeye breed. I've been doing my due diligence as best as I can, and hope to do the breed justice. I have one Buckeye rooster, and three hens. I have some hatching eggs coming from Alberta from another Canadian Buckeye chicken breed enthusiast. Wish me luck!


Good luck and welcome to the forum.


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## Circle_U_Farm

Nm156 said:


> SOP or SOuP.............................................


It's hard to get a good idea of a bird from just one photo. If you could get shots of the body and head from above, we could get a better idea of the type on him.


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## Circle_U_Farm

And also pics from the front an rear as well.


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## Nm156

Thanks he's nothing special and i don't plan on trying to show him.


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## Nm156

He was giving to me and have no idea where he's from.I assume a hatchery Buck.


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## seminole wind

CanadianBuckeye said:


> Hi everyone. I'm new here, and new to the Buckeye breed. I've been doing my due diligence as best as I can, and hope to do the breed justice. I have one Buckeye rooster, and three hens. I have some hatching eggs coming from Alberta from another Canadian Buckeye chicken breed enthusiast. Wish me luck!


Welcome! It's nice to have breed enthusiasts here!


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## seminole wind

Nm156 said:


> Thanks he's nothing special and i don't plan on trying to show him.


I'm glad you posted him. Good or not so good, it's interesting to critique a bird anyway.


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## CanadianBuckeye

I got my Buckeye eggs in today, well shaken by the courier. One egg was broken, and most of the others have detached air sacs and some are even frothy looking.  The eggs are resting in the ICU for a day, hopefully some of those sacs will heal a little. 

I've got big hopes for these guys and gals!


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## Shumaker

Nm156 said:


> SOP or SOuP.............................................


Soup, nothing about that bird is appealing. I have so many good examples of good Buckeye males on my website. You can compare. Hope that helps .


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## Shumaker

robin416 said:


> Leave it alone, Margengoite, the situation has been handled. He won't be answering questions from here any more.


That's probably for the best. Overall subject matter knowledge is extremely limited! Ability to attack others with opinions different that his is great!

Bottom line ........ There is a better class of buckeyes and much more credible knowledge available for those that truely want to do the Buckeye breed justice.


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## Shumaker

Nm156 said:


> He was giving to me and have no idea where he's from.I assume a hatchery Buck.


He's multi-shaded, his head is to small, his gills are too large. Based on the color alone, he is not a good example of the breed. He looks like an ALBC example of the breed. That organization has set the breed back at least a decade. Sadly enough, they have garnered following that aren't the sharpest tacks in the wall and continue to peddle these poor examples of the Buckeye breed.


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## Shumaker

Here is a young pullet at 9 weeks old...she weighs 3 lbs 1 oz and is growing great.


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## Shumaker

Good looking Buckeye chicks.


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## Nm156

Thanks for the confirmation ........


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## seminole wind

CanadianBuckeye said:


> I got my Buckeye eggs in today, well shaken by the courier. One egg was broken, and most of the others have detached air sacs and some are even frothy looking.  The eggs are resting in the ICU for a day, hopefully some of those sacs will heal a little.
> 
> I've got big hopes for these guys and gals!


welcome! I would like to try wrapping eggs in a box and see how much energy it takes to break them. It really pi$$es me off. I spend a small fortune wrapping eggs. Instead of printing "fragile" on the package, I'm writing "future chicks-depending how this package is handled". Somebody out there must have a conscience.


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## seminole wind

Nm156 said:


> Thanks for the confirmation ........


Don't be too sad , LOL. I have a show quality BLPolish, but she has spurs.


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## seminole wind

I thought the "Buckeye" state might be the state's bird. Sadly it's a nut that looks like a buck's eye (translated from the Indian word)


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## Nm156

seminolewind said:


> Don't be too sad , LOL. I have a show quality BLPolish, but she has spurs.


Trust me I'm not sad about it.He prove a point and I'm thankful for the participation.


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## CanadianBuckeye

seminolewind said:


> welcome! I would like to try wrapping eggs in a box and see how much energy it takes to break them. It really pi$$es me off. I spend a small fortune wrapping eggs. Instead of printing "fragile" on the package, I'm writing "future chicks-depending how this package is handled". Somebody out there must have a conscience.


Actually I got two boxes of eggs, but the second one was delivered by a chicken enthusiast driver who handed the box over as carefully as if it was a baby in there. Out of 48 eggs, only one had a slightly wobbly air sac, the rest were perfect, as if they never traveled. Thanks Mr. Fed Ex.!!!  They will be my carrier of choice if I ever ship eggs. 
Although the two boxes were packaged differently, there's no packaging that will fix rough handling.


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## seminole wind

Maybe some of you remember RiderKen from years back. He said he got his rooster as an Ameraucana and was showed by someone as one. He fell in love with this rooster, and at some point months later, the guy gave him the roo. He was beautiful. He was producing fertile eggs off a flock of EE hens. These 3 women on another site were bashing his rooster down in the "auction/sale area, and I got involved in defending him (I knew he was older in a wheel chair with oxygen tubing). Those wenches backed down. I ended up getting eggs from him and hatching some nice birds, one a rooster. Probably one of the most beautiful roos I ever saw. I had to rehome him and took him to a swap, and someone was crazy about him and paid me $30. He was gorgeous. Maybe I can find the old pictures. 

That was one of the very very few times I've witnessed a heated argument over a breed.


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## Marengoite

seminolewind said:


> I thought the "Buckeye" state might be the state's bird. Sadly it's a nut that looks like a buck's eye (translated from the Indian word)


If Shumaker gets his way, this might be rectified.


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## CanadianBuckeye

Five of my badly shaken Buckeye hatching eggs (of 30) are developing. I'd be thrilled if they hatched.


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## seminole wind

I hope so too. I mailed some goose eggs to an ebay person, and most were shaken. If you would have seen the obscene amount of wrapping I did. Only for nothing.


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## CanadianBuckeye

Thanks Seminolewind. I have high hopes for these little guys, they will improve my tiny Buckeye flock if they make it.


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