# Code enforcement/animal care and control



## dawg53 (Aug 25, 2015)

For all who are interested: I sent this to Karen first, and she suggested that I post it .

This might be rather long.
I dont know if you remember; awhile back I posted about my next door neighbor not properly taking care of their chickens, feeding and watering them. Their coop was built on the side of their yard up against their privacy fence on the property line with us.
Their coop was uncovered, nothing to protect them from the elements. They rarely fed or kept water in their small pen. They had a beautiful Buff Orpington rooster that lived for a long time and it finally died the other day of malnutrition, a hen also died.
Both birds had shrunk so bad that nothing could've saved them. There are 3 or 4 hens still in the small coop.

I called both animal control and code enforcement last Thursday. Animal control normally doesnt respond to chicken calls per the ordinance. But they responded as a "nuisance" call due to the foul odor of the dead chickens. They called the owners and told them to feed their chickens and remove the carcasses, which my neighbor complied. They didnt provide water for the rest of their birds. Idiots.

Yesterday a lady from code enforcement showed up and I explained everything to her including the fact that I had "educated" and even previously provided my neighbors a sack of feed for their birds.
The officer went and spoke to the neighbors wife. After a while the officer informed me that the lady claimed she didnt know english and her husband would take care of it. (They are from Haiti and she understands english, and I told the officer that.)

The officer wasnt a happy camper about the abuse and neglect of their chickens.
She wrote a citation with the following charges to our neighbor:
1. Failure to provide protective cover over the coop.
2. The coop must be in the back yard, not on the side of their house and must be 5' away
from the property line.
3. Failure to provide proof that someone attended the "chicken keeping class" by U of Fl as
required in the city ordinance....($5 fee required.)
4. Failure to register and pay the one time $25 chicken zoning fee and proof of chicken
keeping class. The zoning fee must be paid downtown.

There was one other charge but I cant remember what it was. All I know is that the officer was PO'd!
She then told me that my neighbors have 16 days to comply, then face a daily fine of $255.00 thereafter if they dont comply.
I doubt my neighbors will fork out any money to keep chickens. So, bye bye chickens, I hope.
If they dont get rid of their chickens in 16 days, I'll be calling the same code enforcement officer, and I have her card.
I really didnt like squealing on my neighbor. We never had any problems with them, except the chicken issue. I bent over backwards for them, even showing them my coop/pen set up,explained what they needed to do etc...I even went and reminded them several times to provide feed and water during the hot summer months, but they rarely complied.
Knuckleheads will now have to learn the hard way.


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## Nm156 (May 16, 2015)

It says error


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## dawg53 (Aug 25, 2015)

Nm156 said:


> It says error


The link opened for me and I was able to read it all. Maybe a mod needs to take a look at it and see if there's a problem.


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## Nm156 (May 16, 2015)

I think you posted it from your email page/inbox 
.


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## dawg53 (Aug 25, 2015)

Yes I did. I dont know how to make it readable for everyone.


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## chickenqueen (Jan 9, 2016)

I got error,too.I don't know how to fix it,either.


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## seminole wind (Aug 22, 2015)

dawg53 said:


> For all who are interested: I sent this to Karen first, and she suggested that I post it for all to read.
> https://www.chickenforum.com/conversations/code-enforcement-animal-care-and-control.42416/


This might be rather long. 
I dont know if you remember; awhile back I posted about my next door neighbor not properly taking care of their chickens, feeding and watering them. Their coop was built on the side of their yard up against their privacy fence on the property line with us.
Their coop was uncovered, nothing to protect them from theelements. They rarely fed or kept water in their small pen. They had a beautiful Buff Orpington rooster that lived for a long time and itfinally died the other day of malnutrition, a hen also died. 
Both birds had shrunk so bad that nothing couldve saved them. There are 3 or 4 hens still in the small coop.

I called both animal control and code enforcement last Thursday. Animal control normally doesnt respond to chicken calls per theordinance. But they responded as a "nuisance" call due to the foul odor of the dead chickens. They called the owners and told them to feed their chickens and remove the carcasses, which myneighbor complied. They didnt provide water for the rest of theirbirds. Idiots.

Yesterday a lady from code enforcement showed up and Iexplained everything to her including the fact that I had "educated"and even previously provided my neighbors a sack of feed for theirbirds. 
The officer went and spoke to the neighbors wife. After a while theofficer informed me that the lady claimed she didnt know englishand her husband would take care of it. (They are from Haiti andshe understands english, and I told the officer that.)

The officer wasnt a happy camper about the abuse and neglect of their chickens.
She wrote a citation with the following charges to our neighbor:
1. Failure to provide protective cover over the coop. 
2. The coop must be in the back yard, not on the side of their houseand must be 5' away 
from the property line.
3. Failure to provide proof that someone attended the "chickenkeeping class" by U of Fl as 
required in the city ordinance....($5 fee required.)
4. Failure to register and pay the one time $25 chicken zoning fee and proof of chicken 
keeping class. The zoning fee must be paid downtown.

There was one other charge but I cant remember what it was. All Iknow is that the officer was PO'd! 
She then told me that my neighbors have 16 days to comply, then face a daily fine of $255.00 thereafter if they dont comply.
I doubt my neighbors will fork out any money to keep chickens. So, bye bye chickens, I hope.
If they dont get rid of their chickens in 16 days, I'll be calling the same code enforcement officer, and I have her card.
I really didnt like squealing on my neighbor. We never had anyproblems with them, except the chicken issue. I bent over backwards for them, even showing them my coop/pen set up,explained what they needed to do etc...I even went and reminded them several times to provide feed and water during the hotsummer months, but they rarely complied.
Knuckleheads will now have to learn the hard way.


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## boskelli1571 (Oct 30, 2017)

seminolewind said:


> This might be rather long.
> I dont know if you remember; awhile back I posted about my next door neighbor not properly taking care of their chickens, feeding and watering them. Their coop was built on the side of their yard up against their privacy fence on the property line with us.
> Their coop was uncovered, nothing to protect them from theelements. They rarely fed or kept water in their small pen. They had a beautiful Buff Orpington rooster that lived for a long time and itfinally died the other day of malnutrition, a hen also died.
> Both birds had shrunk so bad that nothing couldve saved them. There are 3 or 4 hens still in the small coop.
> ...


I'm glad you turned them in - there is no excuse for neglect and cruelty to living creatures - it has nothing to do with language barriers and everything to do with being humane....B*******!
Sorry! I'll get off my soapbox now - well done Dawg


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## Sara Silver (Nov 27, 2017)

dawg53 said:


> For all who are interested: I sent this to Karen first, and she suggested that I post it .
> 
> This might be rather long.
> I dont know if you remember; awhile back I posted about my next door neighbor not properly taking care of their chickens, feeding and watering them. Their coop was built on the side of their yard up against their privacy fence on the property line with us.
> ...


That's more than just being a couple knuckleheads...those people are downright depraved. It doesn't take a class for someone to know that a creature, any creature needs food and water to survive. Sheesh, what are they even keeping the poor things for? I can't imagine the hens are able to produce any eggs in that condition!


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## dawg53 (Aug 25, 2015)

Sara Silver. Believe it of not, two years ago one of their hens hatched one egg. Somehow the chick grew to become a malnourished pullet. It was sad to hear the poor thing constantly cheeping for lack of food and water. It died. Prior to that, I walked to their front door with a 50lb sack of feed and gave it them, and mentioned to them several times about giving their birds water. They looked at me like I was nuts, finally his wife said 'thank you.'

One time they had two roosters mixed in with the hens. There was the big Buff Orpington rooster and a small Hamburg type rooster. The small rooster was a beautiful looking bird. After awhile, I didnt hear the small rooster crowing anymore. I looked through the wooden slats in the privacy fence and saw the poor rooster all beat up, with scabs and a huge swollen eye. I knew it had been severely pecked by the big rooster and probably the hens. I also knew it would be a vector for disease.
I went over to the front door and told them them about the small rooster. Since I wasnt getting anywhere with them in the conversation, I threatened to call zoning on them due to the possibility of the sick and injured rooster spreading disease to my chickens. That got their attention and the husband said he'd kill the small rooster, he complied that same day.
I could go on with a few more instances, but you get the picture about neglect and abuse.

The good news is that this past Sunday they removed all their birds and gave them away.
I'm hoping code enforcement follows up on the violations after the alloted time passes. The coop needs to be moved to their backyard or dismantled. If not, I'll be calling code enforcement.
Leaving it in place will eventually tempt them to get more birds.


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## chickenqueen (Jan 9, 2016)

I know what I want to say but this forum won't allow it.Dawg,you did the right thing.I don't know how you waited so long.When my neighbors don't buy feed,they just turn them loose to eat my feed.So I reckon they "care" somewhat but are too lazy/broke to get feed.And they have the nerve to complain about my geese wandering into their yard occasionally to eat their grass(I didn't like it either and put a fence up over the summer so that stopped).I think it's neat people need to take classes before chicken keeping but paying for a permit not so much.Sounds like another way to separate you from your money because they said so...


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## seminole wind (Aug 22, 2015)

NOT to mention the animal lover's anguish right under his nose. I'm glad you kept at it.


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## dawg53 (Aug 25, 2015)

chickenqueen said:


> I think it's neat people need to take classes before chicken keeping but paying for a permit not so much.Sounds like another way to separate you from your money because they said so...


CQ. In this instance, the system worked. Two out of 5 violations were not taking a chicken class, and not having a permit. For a one time $25 fee, they can afford it....trust me.


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## oldhen2345 (May 14, 2017)

Dawg- I salute you. There are just people in the world who should not have chickens, dogs or children. These people seem the type. I have a friend whose neighbor has chickens, geese, guineas, gamebirds and rabbits. The birds are not kept in a confined area- she is in the city and lets them "free range" everywhere over the neighborhood. Some have laid eggs in my friend's garage. I hatched out 4 of them last year for the fun of it. 3 bantams and one regular size- all barnyard mix. Some have been killed by dogs, cats and other predators. But, enough keep hatching eggs that she stays in business. All the birds are thin and scraggly looking. I think her idea is that free range means she doesn't have to put out very much feed. She does put out feed- but I don't think each species eats something specific for it. I think she mixes and matches whatever she has on hand. My friend is keeping an eye on the situation.


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## seminole wind (Aug 22, 2015)

I would not want to see any cruelty or poor care at my house/neighborhood. I would raise he11.


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## dawg53 (Aug 25, 2015)

As far as doing something about the situation sooner rather than later, I needed proof for animal care and control and code enforcement. Now there is documentation and a history for my neighbors which will have future consequences if they get animals for pets or more chickens.
The city gets hundreds of complaints a day. I'm sure they filter out the non important nitnoid complaints. Proof, here it is: You are looking at what used to be a big beautiful BO rooster...dead. 
You cant see it, there's a dead hen laying in front of the dead rooster.


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## seminole wind (Aug 22, 2015)

That's disgusting. 

My neighbors used to have chickens. They don't anymore. They never wormed or powdered and Mr. Only spoke spanish. But his chickens had shade, a safe coop, great food and water and used to get a daily pan of leftovers. Not perfect care but better than most.


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## dawg53 (Aug 25, 2015)

Good news! The neighbor dismantled and tore apart his shoddy coop.


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## seminole wind (Aug 22, 2015)

good for you. It couldn't have smelled good with the filth and dead chicken there. I'm surprised you moved from larger property in Georgia to a neighborhood in Jacksonville. I personally would have chose something that is more like outskirts with a bit of room between neighbors. Get Sharon a wheelbarrow and pitchfork for xmas . And some of her very own chicks to love and grow. Get a little pushy! 

With my hubs, he had no interest in chickens until one jumped on him and wanted to be friends. Now he is very attached to them.


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## dawg53 (Aug 25, 2015)

Sharon inherited this house from her mom and it was paid off. Sharon's old house was paid off too, but had a much smaller yard than we have now. Not to mention the hordes of stinking cats in the old neighborhood. You had to watch where you stepped in the yard. Most of the lazy cats didnt bury their poop. From my experience of stepping in it, I can tell you that it's worse than stepping in a fresh pile of dog crap. It was a no brainer to move here where we're at now.
Sharon takes care of the house, I take care of the yard lol.

We WERE looking at homes with property up around Hilliard, Callahan and Bryceville in Nassau county (and east/northeast Tennessee.) The prices are just out of this world. It's the same for Baker and Columbia counties in Florida. We didnt bother looking at property south of us, we didnt want to move south. 
Actually Jacksonville isnt an expensive place to live, and for the most part, we like it here. Everything is close, less driving, and competition drives down prices. We've decided to stay put. Besides, we need to live close to a military installation; hospital, commissary, pharmacy etc...
There IS the crime factor though. We are prepared. We both have our CWP's. I was also a self defense instructor in the Navy.

Georgia is out of the question. It has state tax and the small towns and counties are always raising millage rates = higher taxes for their non useful nitnoid pet projects that only few complain about. The good ole boy system at its best. I shouldve moved to Florida many years ago and bought me some swamp land on the cheap like everyone else lol.

The only gripe I have about Florida is the initial cost of registering a vehicle, $225 per vehicle for starters, not including the rate for the weight of the vehicle! A fee for this and a fee for that. $$$ Grrrr.
However after the initial registration, it's very cheap every year thereafter.
This year I paid less than $300 for my truck, car, motorcycle, boat, and boat trailer...and that was for TWO years!
If I had been in Georgia, the truck alone wouldve been almost $300 for registration for one year.
Additionally, the city of Jacksonville provides much more property tax exemptions than up in Georgia.


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## seminole wind (Aug 22, 2015)

Price, prices are great around Lexington KY
And southern indiana. 
I wonder how many bases florida has?


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## Wilbur's Mom (Aug 10, 2017)

We live in a rural county that the cost of living is quite low. Sales tax for our county is 8% and 9% in the city. Milleage rate is .23 (I think), hasn't changed in a while. Gas is running $2.09 right now. We are 10 mins from the city, which is great if the kids get sick. Our crime rate has risen some, but holding for now. Hubby and I have our CWP's as well and we are prepared here. Have some trouble with wanderers by the bridge, so we keep our eyes open. As for enforcement, in the county they only deal with domestic animals and I don't think chickens and pigs are an issue. Feral pigs/hogs are on the other side of the county. Coyotes of course, but they have been quiet lately.


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## Wilbur's Mom (Aug 10, 2017)

We are have put in an offer for land, be about 10 acres total. Medicaid is involved, so who knows if they will accept or not. But if they do, I get more chickens and a bigger coop!! So am hoping !!!


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## seminole wind (Aug 22, 2015)

How does Medicaid help you? Does it include a house?


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## Wilbur's Mom (Aug 10, 2017)

No the guy who owns the land is in a nursing home and Medicaid is requiring he sell all of his assets before they will pay for his care. His wife passed a couple of years ago.


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## seminole wind (Aug 22, 2015)

That really stinks.


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## dawg53 (Aug 25, 2015)

Wilbur's Mom said:


> No the guy who owns the land is in a nursing home and Medicaid is requiring he sell all of his assets before they will pay for his care. His wife passed a couple of years ago.


I'll be going through that in a few years with my mom, getting medicaid for her nursing home stay. Luckily I sold her house and most of her material things, donated other stuff that didnt sell. 
She's going to outlive me and she already told me that lol.


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## seminole wind (Aug 22, 2015)

It sounds like you have a good plan. It's just friggin BS for a person given let's say 30 years to his country and then not a concern anymore.


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## Wilbur's Mom (Aug 10, 2017)

I do feel bad for him. We've known him and his wife for years. He was always an .. but she is nice. Hope to hear on this soon, need to get the house ready to sell and get house plans going. Girls have already chimed in on how they want their rooms... I get bigger place for chickens so I'm good.


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## seminole wind (Aug 22, 2015)

What was interesting in my group home travels is seeing houses set up for Medicaid people, like 6-8 to a house with private or semi private rooms and the employees brought them their 3 meals a day and their meds, and that was it. They could sit outside and have coffee and smoke all day if they wanted. I'd rather be there if I have to be somewhere until I can't do for myself.


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## dawg53 (Aug 25, 2015)

I told my wife to put me in the VA home over at Lake City, Fl when my time comes. I told her to visit me once a month and bring me a bag of cheetos, bring one of my chickens in a cage and dont forget the dog.


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## seminole wind (Aug 22, 2015)

I guess I was talking about a VA home. You're too funny!


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## dawg53 (Aug 25, 2015)

Well, I certainly dont want to go to the VA nursing home in Gainesville....too many Gators!


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## Wilbur's Mom (Aug 10, 2017)

I think either one sucks honestly, but VA is where my dad wants to go if he to choose. I here ya dawg!! But they are Gator fans . VA has been better in FL than in OK. When did you serve and thank you for your service!!


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## dawg53 (Aug 25, 2015)

Wilbur's Mom said:


> I think either one sucks honestly, but VA is where my dad wants to go if he to choose. I here ya dawg!! But they are Gator fans . VA has been better in FL than in OK. When did you serve and thank you for your service!!


Oct 71- Oct 92 Navy.


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## seminole wind (Aug 22, 2015)

Wow a real lifer! My dad was a lifer and so was my SIL.


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## dawg53 (Aug 25, 2015)

seminolewind said:


> Wow a real lifer! My dad was a lifer and so was my SIL.


So was my dad. Our family has a history of military service.


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## Wilbur's Mom (Aug 10, 2017)

dawg53 said:


> So was my dad. Our family has a history of military service.


Our family as well. My dad was Marine Corp Vietnam. They live in Melbourne, FL now.


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## dawg53 (Aug 25, 2015)

Wilbur's Mom said:


> Our family as well. My dad was Marine Corp Vietnam. They live in Melbourne, FL now.


My dad was in the Navy as well, airdale. He served in WW2, Korea, and Nam. I served during Nam, Libya, and first Gulf war. I guess I took his place except I wasnt an airdale lol.
My parents used to live in Indian Harbour Beach, Fl back in the 80's. It was always great fishing down there when I visited them.


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## Wilbur's Mom (Aug 10, 2017)

dawg53 said:


> My dad was in the Navy as well, airdale. He served in WW2, Korea, and Nam. I served during Nam, Libya, and first Gulf war. I guess I took his place except I wasnt an airdale lol.
> My parents used to live in Indian Harbour Beach, Fl back in the 80's. It was always great fishing down there when I visited them.


 I was born in Cocoa Beach! Cape Canaveral Hospital.


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