# 6 year old Barredrock tossing her head back



## Barredrockmom (Jun 27, 2014)

I found my hen this morning in the coop moving her head around funny. She would pull it in all the way and some tossing it over her back in a circular motion. She has partially seeds from last night in her crop with one clump I was able to break up with my hand. She is disoriented and acts like she is trying to see but reacts to my hand movement near her face. 

This is my lead hen. Yesterday I gave all the birds some steamed squash I no longer wanted. It was freshly cooked. There was some cheese scraps from tacos too. Not more than an eighth of a cup. 

She is resting in a little cage comfortably. I don't notice any smell and she pooped normally today. Off to smell her crop.


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## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

Check her ears, make sure nothing is there. If not put her on B12 because this sounds like stargazing. If you have it check the ingredients on the bottle of nutri drench. 

Your girl is up there in years, isn't she?


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## Barredrockmom (Jun 27, 2014)

Thanks for the quick reply Robin. I do have B12 in a tiny tablet you put under the tongue. I can dissolve it in water. It was especially a quick rise in summer her. It went from 70 to 98 in 5 days. 

What is weird is when I give her little drops of water on her beak, she pulls her neck in tight and acts like it is obstructing her neck. She is woobely on her feet. 

I don't have drench but will see if the store does down the hill. Like I said, she acts weird, tucks her neck and acts panicky when I drop water on her beak, then that quickly it goes away. Want to make sure it is OK to give water before administering the B12. I will wait for your response before doing any more.


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## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

Not sure that type of B12 will work. That form works by absorbing quickly through the tissues of the mouth. Not sure it can survive the the GI tract. 

I wouldn't read too much in to her behavior with the water since we all get a bit weird when our bodies are not up to snuff. But if she's gorging herself on seed to the point that its not leaving her crop there might be another issue there. Only time will tell though. B12 or nutri drench to see if she straightens out.

I saw that with Head Tuck, my head injury bird. She tucked whenever stress was high, temps, being broody that type of thing. She hasn't done it since she quit laying but your thinking the heat stress brought this out is probably correct. With Head Tuck I did up her nutrition which always seemed to work for her.


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## Barredrockmom (Jun 27, 2014)

Shoot. I just gave the sub-lingual as she started presenting more of what you call Star Gazing which is exactly what it looks like now. I do have another B formula. Do you think chickens can get too much B12 even though it is quickly excreted in the urine?


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## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

Yes, they can. I did some checking for someone else about too much. Yes, its excreted through the kidneys but if the kidneys are trying to rid the body of mega doses it can cause kidney stones. It can also cause skin problems. Mega doses can also interfere with the proper utilization of other vitamins. And it has to be 12 (thiamine) since that is the indicator for a deficiency of that particular B vitamin.

Nutri Drench is probably your best choice once you can get her more normal. I didn't dose Head Tuck unless I saw her tucking because too much of a good thing can also be a bad thing.


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## Barredrockmom (Jun 27, 2014)

All I have is B complex in powder form. I will wait till the feed store opens to see if I can get some drench.

I just looked at her a few minutes ago to see how she was doing. She was standing and looking around normal but a few minutes later she was doing the stargazing again. I thought it had worked. All else is normal. Nice breath, pooping normally. Eye dilation normal.


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## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

Go ahead and give her the B complex. It might be enough to get her started in the right direction.


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## Barredrockmom (Jun 27, 2014)

Will do. It is 8:19 just to log the time as I forget. LOL


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## Barredrockmom (Jun 27, 2014)

I don't know if this condition kept her up all last night or what. But she is real calm, acting like she is sleepy but still mild stargazing. It is 9:39. Off to find some Drench.


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## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

The supplement will not fix her immediately, it can take days. 

Help her if you have to to make sure she's eating and drinking. I've never had a stargazer so I don't know if this will work for you or not. If Head Tuck was tucking I could hold my hand under her chin and stop the spasm causing her to tuck. You might be able to do the same thing with your girl if you can get control of her head. Don't actually hold it in place but use your hand as a stop so the head can non go off in multiple directions.


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## Barredrockmom (Jun 27, 2014)

She just stood and ate peas and yogurt. She looks to be much better. Thanks Robin for being here so fast. Your a Dear.


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## Barredrockmom (Jun 27, 2014)

That's it Robin. It is 130 P.M. and she is fully recovered. She even laid an egg and is back out in the yard. It is cool today and all the waterer's have this electrolyte formula in them. Now I have learned yet another thing about chickens from you and this forum.


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## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

Glad to read it. Its up to you on whether or not you dose her a couple extra times. With Head Tuck once she was up, I would dose her a couple days just to be safe. Can't say that kept her from tucking again right away but I've still got her nine years later.


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## Barredrockmom (Jun 27, 2014)

Yes. I woke to her bed mate clucking loudly at 5:30 this am. Lacy was on the floor of the coop shaking a little. I picked her up and she came out of it. So I did dose her this afternoon again. I will keep it up until she is fully recovered. She is a huge bodied bird and must weigh 7 pounds. I used to call her the Tank as she comes thundering out of bushes to chase off wild jays and such. She means real business too. But she is a love to me. We are going into the triple digits next week. Ouch


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## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

I don't like the sounds of that. Certainly keep her on the thiamine for a while. Did you stop giving it to her once she appeared to recover?

I hope she turns around and stays that way.


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## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

BTW, we've gotten beyond hot down here too. I rigged up one of those small cement mixing pans with sand in the bottom and water on top for the birds to get in to cool off. I even put King in there today. He actually stayed put for a minute. 

I put the sand in because the pan was too slippery with just the water in it.


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## Barredrockmom (Jun 27, 2014)

I have the chicken electrolytes in all water containers for a few days. She woke normal today. I see her drinking the solution and don't want to over dose her on B as I read it can be liver toxic on the Merk site? She eats like a race horse thus her "tank" nick name. lOL I want to put up the misters but Ca is in a drought and that extra water will get us one big fine if we go over normal usage.


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## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

I would like to see whatever it was you read about liver toxicity. B vitamins go through the kidneys and excess is expelled from the body. Too much B can cause kidney stones and possibly kidney failure when they are on mega doses over a long period of time.


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## Barredrockmom (Jun 27, 2014)

I went back to the Merk site and yes. I got that wrong. She is doing fine now. No more signs of tremors. It is day three after supplementation. All the eggs had this gold?orange color. Looked like Easter eggs. LOL


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## Buckeye209 (Aug 11, 2015)

I'm in the ca drought too and it's suprising as residents and farmers conserve how many businesses still are wasting water


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## dawg53 (Aug 25, 2015)

Stargazing is caused by a thiamine deficiency in the diet. 
http://ultimatefowl.com/wiki/index.php?title=Thiamine_Deficiency
Avian Super Pack or Vitamin B1 combined with selenium will correct stargazing.


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## Akarnf2 (Dec 27, 2014)

If she eats a balanced feed why she will have any nutritional deficiency? I think that a bacterial infection is also a possibility.


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## Alaskan (Aug 22, 2015)

It is possible for the following reasons:
--Some intestinal imbalance (worms, or a bacterial overgrowth) that make it difficult for her to absorb vitamins properly
-- in a chick, parents that were lacking in vitamins
-- feed that is too old, or that got too hot, or for whatever reason doesn't have the nutrition that it should
-- some genetic issue that causes the hen to have malabsorption issues.


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## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

If I remember right this was a six or seven year old hen.


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## Akarnf2 (Dec 27, 2014)

If she have any of this problems, I don't think that giving her any extra vitamins will Solve the problem. If she can't absorb the vitamins from the feed she will not absorb them from the extra vitamins she will get from the water, or feed. 
The chicken owner should first treat the origin of the problem, If he can!


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## Buckeye209 (Aug 11, 2015)

Perhaps her old age is the issue at hand,just make her as comfortable and stress free as possible if this is the case and enjoy your time left with her


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## Barredrockmom (Jun 27, 2014)

Ive been MIA for a while. Some of the comments really piss me off and rather than get kicked off, I took a sabbatical. I decided to respond to the what if's and assuming my hen is on death's bed. Robin was right. What was discussed briefly was the stress factor of the extreme heat here. On top of that, I can't use the misters I used before due to water restriction. As some of us might know, when an animal is heat stressed, the organs and digestion do not function normally. It is the bodies way of protecting the vital organs. 

As of last date, Lacy is very healthy and has never had another issue. I'm so happy Robin is available to help us when we have emergencies. Thank You Robin.


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## Barredrockmom (Jun 27, 2014)

Lacy last week. Still a tank and running the flock.


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## Buckeye209 (Aug 11, 2015)

Well that's great glad I was wrong and that everything seems to be going good


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## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

My Head Tuck, head injury bird, will tuck when she gets stressed. This summer's intense heat and humidity had her tucking.


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