# Deep Litter Method



## Cockadoodledoo (Jan 28, 2016)

Just wanted to see what everyone's opinions are on the deep Litter method. I.e. composting right in the coop by turning bedding and poo regularly and letting the good bugs compost everything.


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## Nm156 (May 16, 2015)

I have a wood floor so no deep litter for me.


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## nannypattyrn (Aug 23, 2015)

I don't like it. It stinks even when it's turned. I think it just invites disease. I use dry sand and rake it up every day or 3 at the most.


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## MikeA_15 (Feb 21, 2016)

heididmitchell said:


> Just wanted to see what everyone's opinions are on the deep Litter method. I.e. composting right in the coop by turning bedding and poo regularly and letting the good bugs compost everything.


From what I've read composted litter/deep litter/ built up litter was the result of farm labor shortages during World War Two. Birds were surviving despite neglect and no animal protein, which means lack of B vitamins which are not found in abundance in plant proteins. B12 was discovered in litter as a by product of bacterial action. When B12 was identified around 1950, it started being used by mills as an addition to poultry feeds. This made this compost litter idea irrelevant.

The anti-coccidial effect of composted litter is not consistent either. Where bacteria in composted litter has been known to deteriorate Cocci protozoa, the protozoa still exists in numbers which would be found outside in soil anyway. I don't know anyone who keeps their birds in a building all day, unless it is a factory farm. Moisture in litter is sure way to have sick birds as well since it attracts molds, pests, and vectors for parasitic worms. And if that isn't enough, anyone who has seen the deterioration of pine shavings or straw over time, knows it can produce lots of dust when chickens kick it around. That's particularly bad for the air sacs of a bird which is a more intricate part of the respiratory system compared to mammalian lungs.

I prefer to use old litter for compost. I like a clean smelling, well ventilated coop. I think the birds do too.


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## dawg53 (Aug 25, 2015)

Deep litter is a hotbed for capillary worms and cockroaches that can carry other types of infective worm eggs.


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## WeeLittleChicken (Aug 31, 2012)

I think deep litter may have been what the previous owners here were trying to do... but they never stirred it and it ended up being literally two and a half feet of impacted goat poop and hay (yes, hay... not straw...) Long story short it took me a long while to haul out those stalls in in the meantime about 30 billion mites bred in that rank mess and we had an epic infestation which I am still dealing with but we're getting a hold of it. 

In any event IF it's something you're interested in you have to keep it DRY or else it will be, as I mentioned, a massive breeding ground for mites.


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## MikeA_15 (Feb 21, 2016)

I can understand people's desire to do what may be naturally beneficial for their chickens. But the people who generally push the theory behind "sustainable-eco-friendly-deep litter method" are neo-hippies which aren't known for practicing good hygiene or having a good work ethic. Deep litter is good for absorbency and preventing bumble foot from jumping down off of roosts. But it does need to be changed periodically. Raising chickens, or any animals for that matter, isn't for lazy people. That is for sure.


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## Cockadoodledoo (Jan 28, 2016)

That's my opinion...but I was just reading a book that swore by it. Seems like wet feet and damp weather would offset the balance and lead to a rash of coccidiosis???? I like the fresh smell of triple screen!


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## dawg53 (Aug 25, 2015)

Try doing deep litter in the hot moist humid south and birds will be susceptible to all kinds of problems. Birds are not going to stay inside the coop and "turn it over" as many people are led to believe. Keeping everything dry is imperative when raising chickens. Moisture is the enemy.
Many chicken owners around here prefer to keep birds on wire while they roost at night inside the coop. These same people also vaccinate their birds for fowl pox.


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## SunshineAcre (Apr 14, 2016)

Everyone we know that does it loves it but we could never to get it to work here. The layout of our coop as well as the cement base of the run prevent it. Hopefully it will work for you!


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## Cockadoodledoo (Jan 28, 2016)

I have my layer coop set up with poo hammocks (made of shade cloth) under the roosts, so most of the poo is collected and put on compost. Because of this the bedding stays clean and dry for much longer. I think this setup is good for me so I don't think I'll switch it up.


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## seminole wind (Aug 22, 2015)

heididmitchell said:


> I have my layer coop set up with poo hammocks (made of shade cloth) under the roosts, so most of the poo is collected and put on compost. Because of this the bedding stays clean and dry for much longer. I think this setup is good for me so I don't think I'll switch it up.


I think your system sounds much better than deep litter. I can't imagine having to empty deep litter one day -all of it. It must take all day or two. Too much for me.

What I try to do is remove the shavings under the roost when needed, then rake the fairly clean shavings from the other side of the coop over under the roost, and add new to the side opposite to the roost.


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## WeeLittleChicken (Aug 31, 2012)

We wet down Equine Pine pellets so they turn into dust and spread that. I go in once a week with a rake to ruffle it all up and keep it powdered instead of clunking together and making a matt. This keeps it dry and expands the duration you can use it for a long while. It smells nice out there. MUCH better than the mess the former owners left me with that goat poop nightmare. When I say it bred mites I mean in apocalyptic proportions. I would go out there and they'd end up covering my arms... hundreds of dirt sized bugs just crawling in my hair and on my arms -- itching! And it was spring and everything was flooding and wet so I couldn't even get a hold of it until now. Been spraying EVERYTHING with tea tree oil/water!! And keeping things dry... and spraying the bird's vents every night. It's working but Jesus, really put me off deep bedding!! I am hoping this is the last 'gift' I have to deal with from the last people. Siiiiiiiiiiiiigh.


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## Cockadoodledoo (Jan 28, 2016)

Do you use the pine pellets with the chickens....or were you talking about your goats only?


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## WeeLittleChicken (Aug 31, 2012)

Chickens. I don't have goats just yet, that was the last owners of the place. They left me a mess. SIGH. (That being said we're getting a doe in milk soon and two doelings. We're huge on the cheese here so that's our next step!!)


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## Cockadoodledoo (Jan 28, 2016)

Hmmm...I might have to try the pellets. Wouldn't hurt to give them a try. It's impossible for me to just stick with the same thing...I'm always switching things up to find the best option for us.


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## Cockadoodledoo (Jan 28, 2016)

The babies are doing well, by the way


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## seminole wind (Aug 22, 2015)

WeeLittleChicken said:


> We wet down Equine Pine pellets so they turn into dust and spread that. I go in once a week with a rake to ruffle it all up and keep it powdered instead of clunking together and making a matt. This keeps it dry and expands the duration you can use it for a long while. It smells nice out there. MUCH better than the mess the former owners left me with that goat poop nightmare. When I say it bred mites I mean in apocalyptic proportions. I would go out there and they'd end up covering my arms... hundreds of dirt sized bugs just crawling in my hair and on my arms -- itching! And it was spring and everything was flooding and wet so I couldn't even get a hold of it until now. Been spraying EVERYTHING with tea tree oil/water!! And keeping things dry... and spraying the bird's vents every night. It's working but Jesus, really put me off deep bedding!! I am hoping this is the last 'gift' I have to deal with from the last people. Siiiiiiiiiiiiigh.


Does tea tree oil kill mites?


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## WeeLittleChicken (Aug 31, 2012)

> Does tea tree oil kill mites?


Oh God yes, tea tree oil kills just about any nasty bug. We used to put three drops of extract in a handful of shampoo when the dogs had fleas... and you could watch them just die on contact. So much stronger/better than even the flea dips. And now I put it with water in a spritz bottle to spray the bird's vent area with which is where those mites seem to converge. It's been a life saver. I don't like using chemical pesticides.



> The babies are doing well, by the way


Awesome! Can't wait to see how many you hatch! (Our hatch has been weird... they've been dribbling out since Thursday and are still hatching.... Not really sure what happened!)


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## dawg53 (Aug 25, 2015)

seminolewind said:


> Does tea tree oil kill mites?


I dont recommend using Tea Tree oil with birds. It can cause paralysis.


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## Cockadoodledoo (Jan 28, 2016)

How the heck do I delete a post...??


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## nannypattyrn (Aug 23, 2015)

You can only edit it, but not delete it...


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## Cockadoodledoo (Jan 28, 2016)

Haha...I know I figured that out, but my brain wouldn't function to respond


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## Cockadoodledoo (Jan 28, 2016)

WeeLittleChicken said:


> We wet down Equine Pine pellets so they turn into dust and spread that. I go in once a week with a rake to ruffle it all up and keep it powdered instead of clunking together and making a matt. This keeps it dry and expands the duration you can use it for a long while. It smells nice out there. MUCH better than the mess the former owners left me with that goat poop nightmare. When I say it bred mites I mean in apocalyptic proportions. I would go out there and they'd end up covering my arms... hundreds of dirt sized bugs just crawling in my hair and on my arms -- itching! And it was spring and everything was flooding and wet so I couldn't even get a hold of it until now. Been spraying EVERYTHING with tea tree oil/water!! And keeping things dry... and spraying the bird's vents every night. It's working but Jesus, really put me off deep bedding!! I am hoping this is the last 'gift' I have to deal with from the last people. Siiiiiiiiiiiiigh.


I tried the equine pellets instead of the triple screen. LOVE IT! I actually laid them down in the adult pen whole. After a few days they had started to fluff out and I raked them around. I misted them and fluffed them out for the juveniles. I'm sticking with triple screen for the chicks...don't know why...just seemed like the thing to do. The coop smells so nice. There was ZERO odor for a long time. I raked with the first sign of odor and the odor went away and I was able to extend the life of the bedding. Thanks for the suggestion.


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## WeeLittleChicken (Aug 31, 2012)

No problem! The reason I wet them down first is so the chickens don't think they're food pellets and eat them. If yours don't then I guess it's not a problem - but if they do eat them they'd expand in their crop and can cause problems blocking them up and whatnot. I'm very happy with my Equine Pine.  I had a few people here that literally said, "I thought chickens smelled... and you have a ton of them but I don't smell anything." Always makes me a happy keeper to get flattery like that!


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## seminole wind (Aug 22, 2015)

Equine pellets? Not enough protein? No calcium?


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## Cockadoodledoo (Jan 28, 2016)

I watched mine for awhile. They all ran in the coop frantically of eat...then we're quickly disappointed!! Hahaha. But, none of them tried to eat them luckily.


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## WeeLittleChicken (Aug 31, 2012)

I don't know - none of mine ever did but that's what I was told when I started using them. I can imagine the Buff Orps I had in the past trying to eat them. Those dim bulbs would try to eat anything.... Those were some fat not terribly bright ladies right there. *cough cough*


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## seminole wind (Aug 22, 2015)

I had one roo in NY who "fell off a truck" and lived with my horses for 4 years. He survived great on sweetfeed. I knew nothing at the time. But he was happy.


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