# Sickly hen



## RhapsodyAcres (Nov 20, 2013)

After we got home this evening, my son found one of our hens laying outside (in the pen). It was after sundown and all the other chickens were in the coop. She was laying on her side, with her left leg held out a little bit toward the back. She couldn't seem to stand on it (would lay back down when he righted her). He picked her up and put her in the coop (in a nest since he didn't think she'd be able to stay upright on a perch) but she's propped up against the side of the nest. What type of illnesses could we be looking at? 

Temps are in the 50s. They get Nutrena All Flock organic feed, fresh water daily, occasional treats (fresh green beans, spinach, etc.). We let them free range when we're home but can't when we're not home. Last year, we lost 10 hens and my favorite rooster to predators (either coyotes, bobcat, neighbor dogs, hawks or eagles) in 2 days. They have a large outdoor pen attached to a large coop.

None of the local vets are farm vets and I just can't justify (financially) calling out my horse vet for a chicken (farm calls are too high), plus I don't know that she has experience with chickens anyway. Should I run to Tractor Supply for some antibiotics in case it's something bacterial or is there something else I should try?


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## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

First you need to establish whether or not there is an injury causing her to be in this position. 

Depending on her age Mareks is a bit of concern but do a close head to toe exam first. 

Does your horse vet have an office? If so, you can take the bird in and have an x-ray done to see if it is a dislocation.


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## RhapsodyAcres (Nov 20, 2013)

Our horse vet is a mobile vet. I don't know if she has an x-ray machine. Plus we just paid a $337 vet bill on our 12yo Golden Retriever last week and that ate up our "contingency" fund. 

Should we bring her inside and put her under a heat lamp? 

I'm 99% sure all of the chickens have been vaccinated for Marek's. The only ones I'm not sure of are the ones we got from a friend several months ago when he was getting out of chickens but I know that at least most of his were (he got his BRs the same time we did, from the same hatchery; I know because I ordered them and he got them from me).


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## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

K. Any possibility of a pic? 

I would not do any supplemental heat until you can establish a bit better what is going on with her. There are just so many things it might be, different diseases, injury of one type or another. 

You need to check the condition of the legs. Does she grab your finger with both. If you move either leg does she respond negatively? At this point you need to do the assessment of her physical condition.

Not knowing where you are I'm going to say wait until tomorrow. No sense in stressing her more than she already is. 

Most mobile vets have x-ray capability in the field. That's just an FYI, no implying you should go that expense to have her come out. I wouldn't. 

I get the expense on the big dogs. I have three that are over 8 now. They range from 80 pounds up to 110. And arthritis has kicked in on the biggest one. Not cheap by any stretch.


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## RhapsodyAcres (Nov 20, 2013)

We don't have lights in the coop so can't do pics until tomorrow morning.

I'll have hubby and the boys check on her after he gets home. He does home health care so has a medical background (though I'm not sure how much of that would translate to chickens!). I'd go but I'm fighting a migraine and nausea (shouldn't be on the computer but I've had to keep up with this thread).

Thank you so much for your responses! 

BTW, we have 3 dogs, too. Max, our Golden, is 12. He's a rescue. He's roughly 80 lbs, give or take a couple lbs. Leia, a terrier mix, is around 8. She was a stray we took in so we don't know exactly how old she is. She weighs about 32 lbs. Lucky, my youngest's Pomeranian, is around 3. He weighs about 10 lbs and is also a rescue. We also have 2 Arabian geldings who have been with us since they were weanlings (they're 17 and 12 now). Anyway, as you can see, we're softies when it comes to our animals.

Max's visit to the vet was due to non-stop vomiting last Friday (a thick, mucous-y bile). Vet found no masses during palpation, temp was good, bloodwork came back within normal ranges so we're a bit baffled. He's feeling better now, fortunately. He was on something for nausea for 2 days and is still on probiotics (30 days) and acid reducer (14 days). Vet wants to do follow-up bloodwork in 6 months.


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## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

Our three didn't come in dribs or drabs, we found them as puppies on the side of the road one day not long after we moved to our new place. They were a mess. Dehydrated, starving and with mange so bad one of them was almost bald. Now the black, almost naked puppies are big boys getting old much too rapidly.

My Keepher, the love of my life, had something similar happen to her. Hers occurred the day after we had to put our other 12 yr old dog, Leon Redbone, down. I took her to the vet first thing, they didn't find anything. I returned to the vet later in the day for different drugs that didn't work. I took her in a second time, insisted that they give her something to stop the vomitting that I truly felt she was having issues with the loss of Leon. Every time Leon had a medical crisis Keepher would be down for a day or two after he was stabilized. She was there when they put him to sleep so it was not a stretch to imagine that she was grieving along with us.

I have found that my medical background has served me well with these guys. Yes, the chickens too. We're taught observation and assessment. With the birds that's even more important since they can present so differently from our other critters. They hide their problems well and its all on us to try to figure out what they're hiding. Our large animal vets very often are quite useful, especially if we can guide them in possible treatment. Heck, there might even be small animal vets that are willing to give it a go now that the bird flu craziness has quieted down.


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## RhapsodyAcres (Nov 20, 2013)

Okay, we brought her inside this morning. She's not looking good. However, I think I know the problem. Her crop is large and hard. We have her in a crate in our Florida room with water (with vitamins & electrolytes) and feed. I'll stop by a store today to get some tubing and if she's still alive will work on getting fluids in her.


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## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

If her crop is blocked, tubing won't get any water in her. The blockage is going to have to come out.


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## RhapsodyAcres (Nov 20, 2013)

How do we do that?

I'm grasping at straws, to be honest, trying to do something, and hoping I've guessed right at what the problem is! 

She's resting on her keelbone with her butt up in the air. Her comb is very pale and flaccid. We did get some water into her but I'm not sure if it helped. There was no poop in the crate since we put here in the crate this morning around 6:30. It's now 1:30.


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## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

If the crop is blocked the only way to be certain it is removed is surgery. I know some have performed this themselves. Its not something I would do on one of my own.

She's in bad shape and probably is not going to make it from here. She might not even be strong enough to come through surgery. I hope I'm wrong but from what you've said so far, its just not looking good.


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## RhapsodyAcres (Nov 20, 2013)

If a chicken has a blocked crop, will it have its head cocked off to the side? It's not off to the side in this photo but she does keep off to the side a good bit.


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## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

Without being there I can't "know" what is going on with her. She looks so wrong in that picture for so many reasons. The tail hiked way the heck up, she looks deformed in the front but the pic is such its hard to tell what is what there.


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## RhapsodyAcres (Nov 20, 2013)

Okay, here's the update. We had given her 20cc of water early this afternoon. We got home tonight and she had pooped once (yay), was laying with her feet under her and her butt was NOT in the air. Her nares look redder and although her comb is still pale, it's not as pale. I don't think she's out of the woods but she seems to be a smidge better. We cleaned out old hay (waterer leaked and crate and hay were wet and the last thing she needs right now is to lay in cold water or on cold hay), dried out the crate, and put in some dry hay.

Reading I did today indicates that hay can cause crop binding. Hubby likes to use hay because it composts well (unlike wood shavings which take much longer). Should we switch to wood shavings anyway, so we don't have this happen again (if, indeed, that's what it was/is)?


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## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

You could switch to alfalfa if he insists on hay. The only negative to that is mold but that's the same problem with using hay at all. If the birds breath in the mold spores they could very well develop a respiratory infection.


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## RhapsodyAcres (Nov 20, 2013)

Our horses don't even get alfalfa to eat! I worry about the Ca-Ph ratio plus it's really pricey here. How about perennial peanut? It's leafy like alfalfa. It's more than coastal but less than alfalfa. 

I think he's just going to have to give way on the hay.


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## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

I know. It nearly broke me when I had to switch my two mares over to it later in their term to keep them off fescue. 

Sure, give the peanut a try if its available. Makes me wonder if its available here since I live in peanut country. Easier than finding alfalfa for them.


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## RhapsodyAcres (Nov 20, 2013)

Hey, I just realized you're in SE Alabama! You should be able to find peanut pretty easily. I live in LA (Lower Alabama) . . . LOL! Just kidding. I'm in the Florida Panhandle. 

And I just have to ask, are you an Auburn or Alabama fan?  I'm an Auburn grad, thereby an Auburn fan. War Eagle!


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## Jeremysbrinkman (Jul 12, 2012)

Sorry to hear about your problems but I wanted to say Roll Tide from SW Alabama


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## RhapsodyAcres (Nov 20, 2013)

Going to be a big day next Saturday! I probably won't watch the game, though; I get too stressed out! LOL! The Georgia game just about did me in! 

I started at Auburn in 1991. The year we won every game but couldn't be on TV or go to a bowl game. But it was a memorable year! Almost as memorable as 2010! Don't you just love SEC football?


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## RhapsodyAcres (Nov 20, 2013)

Well, she rallied briefly but she's looking bad again this morning. She doesn't have her butt up in the air but she's still not moving and her breathing is labored.


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## 7chicks (Jun 29, 2012)

Oh goodness, I was hoping to come on here to find some better news.  Chickens are so good at compensating for so long that before they even show signs of being ill, it sometimes too late no matter what we do. Keeping my fingers crossed that she pulls through.


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## RhapsodyAcres (Nov 20, 2013)

She's still hanging on. I don't know how but she's still alive. I picked up some vitamin/mineral solution and we got about 15cc of water (mixed with electrolytes and the mineral mix) into her tonight. If she's not better by morning, hubby will do what needs to be done. I can't handle seeing her this way. 

She's currently in the dog crate on our kitchen table (courtesy of my hubby). She's wrapped in a towel to help hold her more upright instead of on her side.

On the off chance that what we're dealing with is instead a mite or lice issue, we're going to thoroughly treat the coop this weekend and dust all the birds. We dusted the sick hen some tonight. It was difficult to do but at least we got some (diatomaceous earth) on her. 

I just wish I knew what this was! I'm so frustrated. I thought it might have been a blocked crop but I'm not so sure now.


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## fuzziebutt (Aug 7, 2012)

RhapsodyAcres said:


> Going to be a big day next Saturday! I probably won't watch the game, though; I get too stressed out! LOL! The Georgia game just about did me in!
> 
> I started at Auburn in 1991. The year we won every game but couldn't be on TV or go to a bowl game. But it was a memorable year! Almost as memorable as 2010! Don't you just love SEC football?


I used to have an avatar that said "SEC CHICK", with little yellow chick on it! I've lived in Texas and now in Alabama for a number of years, so if it's not Gig 'em, then it's ROLL TIDE!!!

And sorry about your girl. It really sounds like Marek's to me. Keep a close eye on the rest of the flock.


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## RhapsodyAcres (Nov 20, 2013)

Some details. This hen is at least a year old but probably older. We got her a few months ago from a friend who was getting out of chickens. The Jersey giant died the day after we brought her home (we have no idea why). The barred rocks are doing good (we bought a batch from a hatchery and he got them from us and we got them back from him later) plus the others (I don't know what breeds they are; there were about 12 total). The barred rocks were his youngest birds so this one is maybe 2 years old at minimum.

At this point, I think I'm done with getting chickens from friends. The first batch we got from friends and they were infested with scaly leg mite and it took us awhile to get rid of it (since we didn't recognize it right away as we were totally new to chickens; they were our very first and we were greener than spring grass). Plus, now that we have an established flock we don't have a really good setup for quarantine. We have the top "floor" of a chicken "condo" we can put new birds in but it's still in the same pen and would only fit 4 or 5 adult birds.

We've had losses of birds we bought from a hatchery but most of the ones that have died due to unknown illness have all been birds we've gotten from friends. We don't know their history -- for example, if they've been vaccinated. 

So I've decided I'm done with it. From now on, we only get birds from places that guarantee the birds have been vaccinated. This is just too stressful.

About Marek's - the hen never presented with legs in opposite directions. She had one leg out to the back and when she lays on her side, both legs are stretched out to the back. Her head is resting somewhat back and to the side. Her eyes are mostly closed. She's shedding a LOT of dander (but I didn't see any lice, based on photos I've looked at online).

None of what I'm seeing with her seem to match anything I'm finding online. I was on for HOURS last night looking stuff up.

We gave her some more minerals and water mixed with a little bit of food this morning (Nutrena All Flock).

Since we don't know what it is and the possibility exists it could be Marek's are we better off culling her? We will definitely keep a close eye on the rest of the flock and if any of them start to present like this, too, I would have hubby cull them as well.

This just really stresses me out . . .


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## RhapsodyAcres (Nov 20, 2013)

We let her go this morning. We tried. We failed. I wonder if it was an injury. I just wish I knew what it was.


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## minmin1258 (Nov 5, 2013)

Oh wow, so sorry you lost her. I would be heart broken! I guess I don't know as much about chickens as I thought I did. I'm new at raising chickens and I've done quite a bit of research on care and feeding. But I've learned so much more by reading these threads. I'm sorry you went through all of this, but you sharing your experience has helped others learn as well. I hope your other birds stay healthy. Keep us informed. Please.


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## kessy09 (Jun 16, 2013)

RhapsodyAcres said:


> We let her go this morning. We tried. We failed. I wonder if it was an injury. I just wish I knew what it was.


Sorry for your loss. Did you do a post-mortem? It would be extremely beneficial to determining what was going on and if the rest of your flock is at risk. It is highly suggested to do and would be very educational for you. It helped me through a loss when I discovered what I thought was a tumor actually turn out to be a dislocated shoulder where the muscle had swelled to tumor-like proportions. Eased my mind that the rest of the flock wasn't going to suddenly start growing tumors too.


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