# Chick wing shape



## Biring (Sep 24, 2020)

The reason why I joined this forum a few days ago was that I wanted to ask about something I've noticed with our latest batch of chicks. Unlike the first two batches, which were all more or less the same shape, some of the chicks in our third batch have wings that are noticeably different to those of their sibs and the chicks from batches 1 and 2.

What I want to ask is whether this is recognised as a characteristic of a particular breed or group of breeds. The first picture shows what I would call the standard wing shape for chicks here. The second and third show the new wing shape from some of the chicks in batch 3.


----------



## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

It looks like the bird in the first pic is older than the other two. They change so much in short periods of time you almost need a comparison at the same age. 

Are the peeps in the lower photos full on sibs or are they from a different combination of parents. Genetics of the parent plays a huge part in how they turn out.


----------



## Biring (Sep 24, 2020)

They are all the same age (+/- a few hours). And the photos were taken 20 seconds apart. I’ve noticed some chicks develop feathers much faster than their sibs.

As far as I’m aware they are all full sibs. The mother is full-on FEISTY and won’t let anyone other than the best cockerel near her. She’s the only chicken our dog is scared of!


----------



## Biring (Sep 24, 2020)

Looking back through my photos I noticed the cockerel in question also has a similar wing shape. Maybe it’s a gamefowl trait. Or junglefowl.


----------



## Overmountain1 (Jun 5, 2020)

I just have to add that they're absolutely adorable! I love how they have the light fluff with those colorful wings growing in! So so cute. Ok I'm done now!


----------



## Poultry Judge (Jul 15, 2020)

Biring is doing good sleuthing work! I just typed over half a page of boring explanation about the Oxford versus Carlisle Game split a hundred years ago and I lost it. I am too tired tonight to sort through the wing feather predictor discussion again, maybe tomorrow. Suffice it to say, Biring has an excellent point, I would say take good photos of wings and even make some sketches of feather shape, angle, staggering and coloration on the chicks, this is what they did a hundred years ago to make bird trait predictions within a couple generations. This stuff used to be religion and led to the split in England between the Oxford and Carlisle Poultry Clubs! What is strange is that Sam Brush and I were just talking about my father and the Oxford/Carlisle debate yesterday. Sam is the U.S. APA President and past president of the U.S. Game Club. There aren't too many of us old guys who are interested in this stuff. Many of the books are long out of print but I am always willing to share my archives.


----------



## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

So, what are you thinking about the wings? You kind of got off track there.

I recognize the name Sam Brush. Either from when I was still in the bird world or because you've mentioned his name before.


----------



## Poultry Judge (Jul 15, 2020)

I would have to get out some antique standards manuals with the wing diagrams. I think my point was that folks used to study the wing feathering in great detail on the chicks because they were intentionally creating the new Jungle Fowl Game crosses.


----------



## Poultry Judge (Jul 15, 2020)

Biring said:


> They are all the same age (+/- a few hours). And the photos were taken 20 seconds apart. I've noticed some chicks develop feathers much faster than their sibs.
> 
> As far as I'm aware they are all full sibs. The mother is full-on FEISTY and won't let anyone other than the best cockerel near her. She's the only chicken our dog is scared of!


They will definitely develop at different rates.


----------



## Biring (Sep 24, 2020)

Well that is definitely my intention. We breed chickens here for meat, but broiler chickens are so cheap there is little incentive, so my main aim is to have pretty chickens running around and if we eat one or two here and there so be it. I’d like to breed the gamiest, jungliest chickens I can, given our starting stock, which is a right royal mix of everything.


----------



## Poultry Judge (Jul 15, 2020)

I thought that might be your intention. Well, you are certainly well positioned geographically to find some very interesting Gamefowl and Jungle Fowl which will have a vastly larger historic genetic pool than we have here. Regarding what I was discussing last night, the English Oxford Club was breeding for Game genetic traits but wanted a bird which looked more like a traditional European breed. The English Carlisle Club was breeding for Game and Jungle physical characteristics. If you get interested in the history of this stuff, there is a lot available. Interestingly enough, there seems to be a little bit of a resurgence in keeping and breeding the large Jungle Fowl here. Some of the roosters average 35 inches tall and are very colorful.


----------

