# orpington can't walk



## GageM (Dec 5, 2021)

so i have a buff orpington.. 5 or 6 weeks ago i noticed she would be standing over in a corner slightly hunched and a little puffed up looking in the morning when i would come out. I kept an eye on her and after a week i figured it was nothing. then i started noticing sometimes she would look like she was stumbling or losing her balance.. not constantly but over the course of a few days i had seen it a number of times.. then right before thanksgiving i had to separate her cause she was getting worse and slowly she lost the ability to walk.. so shes been layed up for three weeks or more now.. also this whole time since she couldn't walk her poop has been mostly liquid and very dark almost blackish.. I'll try and post a picture.. the white from her urine will be in it sometimes.. and sometime it has been pretty solid but mostly blackish diarrhea.. when i pick her up she'll move her lets and move her tail feathers alot but she won't walk.. she'll even kick her lets to change positions sometimes but can't walk.. her legs also have like a red stripe down them.. can anyone help me figure out whats going on here? she eats.. she drinks.. I've given her oregano oil in water numerous times.. vitamins..i have 7 other ladys that are unaffected.. need help please. she's around 10 months old


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## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

Do you have any idea when she last laid and egg? Some of what you're describing could be a problem with internal laying. Although she is young for that. 

I'm going to holler for @dawg53 so he can toss in some ideas. 

After this much time I'm not sure there's going to be much that can be done for her. She might have benefitted from a broad spectrum antibiotic in the early days. The puffed up feathers are usually a good sign there is a fever involved.


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## GageM (Dec 5, 2021)

I'm not real sure about when she last laid..she hasn't laid for sure since she's been out of the coop which was 3 or 4 weeks back


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## GageM (Dec 5, 2021)

can someone shed some light here? i got home todat and have another hen not walking well at all.


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## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

OK, now you've got me wondering about botulism poisoning or possibly Mareks. 

Is their feed fresh and kept cool and dry? Is there any wasted feed on the ground? Any place they hang out that might have anything they can eat that they shouldn't?

Molasses is a generally recommended treatment for botulism if that's what it is. 

I need to try to drag @dawg53 into this discussion for what he thinks.


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## GageM (Dec 5, 2021)

robin416 said:


> OK, now you've got me wondering about botulism poisoning or possibly Mareks.
> 
> Is their feed fresh and kept cool and dry? Is there any wasted feed on the ground? Any place they hang out that might have anything they can eat that they shouldn't?
> 
> ...


the orpington that has been laid up for a month now had what we thought was botulism back in mid summer.. started not being able to hold her neck up.. got to the point where she would be standing there but her head would be on the ground.. we separated her and after some research figured it was probably botulism because i ferment feed for them to get onece a day.. we did a molasses flush we read about on another fourm.. a day later she was good to go..


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## GageM (Dec 5, 2021)

GageM said:


> the orpington that has been laid up for a month now had what we thought was botulism back in mid summer.. started not being able to hold her neck up.. got to the point where she would be standing there but her head would be on the ground.. we separated her and after some research figured it was probably botulism because i ferment feed for them to get onece a day.. we did a molasses flush we read about on another fourm.. a day later she was good to go..


this today was more sudden than it with orp last month.. i haven't noticed anything weird lately and then i get home a while ago and one of them is laid out


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## GageM (Dec 5, 2021)

GageM said:


> this today was more sudden than it with orp last month.. i haven't noticed anything weird lately and then i get home a while ago and one of them is laid out


feed is fresh and inside in barrels.. still in the bag.. like i said tho, i do ferment feed


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## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

Stop fermenting. Hopefully, they'll eat the dry feed. 

I truly don't know what it is. And I'm just tossing ideas out there just from what you've said so far. If you do the molasses flush and the birds improve then look at the fermented feed being the problem.


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## dawg53 (Aug 25, 2015)

Other than botulism, black in color poop can be a sign of internal bleeding. My first thought was that your Buff Orpington couldve possibly swallowed a sharp object causing internal bleeding. If that's the case, not much can be done.

Now that a second hen is involved; you stated that the second hen was laid out. Was she laid out with one foot or leg forward and the other foot or leg backward? If so, it could be a sign of Marek's disease.

Also, inspect inside the sack of feed where you open the sack at the top. Look for mold in and around the opening, it will be black in color.

Inspect the feed for any size of clumps or balls of feed. If you see any, that means the feed was wet at one time and then it dried. Return it to the feed store and get a refund or a another sack of feed. Check dates on the tags attached feed sacks. I dont recommend buying feed sacks more than a month old. Sometimes store workers dont rotate feed sacks.

I'm trying to cover all the possibilities that might be happening with your Buff Orpington and your other hen. Botulism has already been covered by Robin.

I agree with stopping the fermented feed.


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## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

I'm glad you weighed in, @dawg53. I'm so out of practice any more that I do want/need more than just my thoughts on some of these mysteries. 

@GageM so much of what goes on with the birds is observation. When we toss out our thoughts we rely on what you observed. Your description of what you saw was pretty good. Now let's see if switching things up will resolve the issues you're seeing.


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## GageM (Dec 5, 2021)

thanks both of you.. I'll check the feed and stop with the fermented feed and see what happens.. as far as when she was laid out..her wings were out so i don't remember for sure. she had diarrhea also about an hour after i found her but it wasn't black


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## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

Please keep us posted. This helps others that might run into the same situation as yours. But if we don't know how it turned out . . . Well, you get what I'm trying to say.


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## GageM (Dec 5, 2021)

GageM said:


> thanks both of you.. I'll check the feed and stop with the fermented feed and see what happens.. as far as when she was laid out..her wings were out so i don't remember for sure. she had diarrhea also about an hour after i found her but it wasn't black


my lady who was down yesterday has passed away.. woke up this morning and she is dead


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## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

Anyway you can keep her body chilled and get her in for a necropsy? It's the one way you can definitevly get an answer to what is going on.

I know the loss is hard and the not knowing why is even harder.


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## GageM (Dec 5, 2021)

robin416 said:


> Anyway you can keep her body chilled and get her in for a necropsy? It's the one way you can definitevly get an answer to what is going on.
> 
> I know the loss is hard and the not knowing why is even harder.


i called around and found a lab that does it for free so I'm taking her now.


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## Poultry Judge (Jul 15, 2020)

Just wondering, who the lab is associated or contracted with? Here in Ohio, both farm bureau and game commission contract with labs to do necropsies on animals for no cost. They generally want to know and track any diseases in the area. It's a good resource to take advantage of.


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## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

GageM said:


> i called around and found a lab that does it for free so I'm taking her now.


I'm glad you were able to locate someone. I should have suggested you call your state vet because they would have had that information too. 

Please keep us posted.


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## GageM (Dec 5, 2021)

the lab is Georgia poultry laboratory and it says they're in partnership with the poultry industry, government and other poultry laboratories to monitor avian health in the state. still no info from them yet but i should hear something at some point today


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## dawg53 (Aug 25, 2015)

GageM said:


> the lab is Georgia poultry laboratory and it says they're in partnership with the poultry industry, government and other poultry laboratories to monitor avian health in the state. still no info from them yet but i should hear something at some point today


I sent a deceased rooster off to the lab in Tifton many years ago. He died from Ecoli bacterial infection. You should get your results soon.





Tifton | Georgia Poultry Laboratory Network







www.gapoultrylab.org


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## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

I guess they'd want to know what's going out there. Ten, twelve years ago the poultry industry was responsible for outbreaks of ILT.


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## GageM (Dec 5, 2021)

dawg53 said:


> I sent a deceased rooster off to the lab in Tifton many years ago. He died from Ecoli bacterial infection. You should get your results soon.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


yeah this is the branch in forsyth.. haven't heard anything yet.. tried to call but with the time of year it may be another few days. hopefully I'll hear something soon and when i do I'll update.


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## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

Thank you. Updates are really how we learn.


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## GageM (Dec 5, 2021)

robin416 said:


> Thank you. Updates are really how we learn.


this morning i got up and at first everyone seemed fine.. but shortly after i noticed one of my ladys just standing on the roost.. she wasn't very interested in eating.. he crop felt like it may have been impacted so i got her a little olive oil and some water and massaged her crop. separated her from the others.. i hope its nothing serious but time will tell.. orp is passing also..not moving much at all and keeping her eyes closed.. once she goes I'll probably try get her to the lab also.. this all just stinks.. pray for my flock..


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## GageM (Dec 5, 2021)

this is her standing there.. other lady is just up there wondering what I'm doing


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## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

I'm so sorry this is happening. I sure hope the lab can find the problem so you can address it before there are any more losses. 

I'm not even sure it's botulism because there are usually additional symptoms. Your girls just seem to go in to not feeling well. Like the flu kind of thing.


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## GageM (Dec 5, 2021)

robin416 said:


> I'm so sorry this is happening. I sure hope the lab can find the problem so you can address it before there are any more losses.
> 
> I'm not even sure it's botulism because there are usually additional symptoms. Your girls just seem to go in to not feeling well. Like the flu kind of thing.


got up this morning and the other hen passed..


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## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

It's got to be the feed. Can you get a different bag? You might be able to stop this with a fresh bag. 

Years ago I lost two high dollar hens to bad feed. I could have kicked myself for not paying closer attention. They just slowly withered away with me not knowing what was going on for a bit. Once I realized it I switched feeds, gave the feed store hell because I learned of a back story about their feed.


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## Poultry Judge (Jul 15, 2020)

robin416 said:


> It's got to be the feed. Can you get a different bag? You might be able to stop this with a fresh bag.
> 
> Years ago I lost two high dollar hens to bad feed. I could have kicked myself for not paying closer attention. They just slowly withered away with me not knowing what was going on for a bit. Once I realized it I switched feeds, gave the feed store hell because I learned of a back story about their feed.


What was the story?


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## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

They broke a sprinkler head. "Thought" they removed all of the affected product. I got it before it became evident that they hadn't gotten it all.


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## Poultry Judge (Jul 15, 2020)

robin416 said:


> They broke a sprinkler head. "Thought" they removed all of the affected product. I got it before it became evident that they hadn't gotten it all.


They should have replaced your birds.


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## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

I agree but they didn't even offer. To them they were just chickens, not birds worth the money I could have sold them for.


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## GageM (Dec 5, 2021)

so the other who was acting weird passed early this morning..her and orp both got dropped off at the lab this morning..they said it would probably be Tuesday before they had info about whats going on. update if anything else happens


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## GageM (Dec 5, 2021)

robin416 said:


> It's got to be the feed. Can you get a different bag? You might be able to stop this with a fresh bag.
> 
> Years ago I lost two high dollar hens to bad feed. I could have kicked myself for not paying closer attention. They just slowly withered away with me not knowing what was going on for a bit. Once I realized it I switched feeds, gave the feed store hell because I learned of a back story about their feed.


i have another bag from the same store.. its purina organic layer.. unopened. otherwise i could run to tractor supply and get a bag of nature's best organic. oh and i do also have a opened bag of purina organic starter crumbles for three pullets i got a week ago. which would you do?


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## GageM (Dec 5, 2021)

somehow i changed something and can only see my posts..


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## robin416 (Sep 8, 2013)

I'm not sure I'd use any of those bags since they were sourced from the same place. Have you checked the dates? Have you checked the crumbles to see if they are free flowing and smell sweet? No little lumps?


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